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Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

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Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#101
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> then will act surprised as Canada's tech sector finds it even harder to create any consumer facing businesses... That's not why an indigenous Canadian tech industry is non-existent. Heck, China, Israel, India, South Korea, and Taiwan all have larger tech industries than Canada and have much stricter internet speech requirements (and in Israel and Taiwan's case are much smaller than Canada population wise). Canadian…

Because US has far better opportunities and more money. My personal experience in doing business in Canada: each industry is monopolized by two or three companies, you need to get their “blessing” before you can do anything in that sector. Government contracts aren’t much, but even with that, it’s nepotism based, you will get a contract knowing someone who will indirectly get benefits from you, for example you will h…

Yep, ever the same since the Hudsons Bay Company and the Northwest Company ran the whole place.

Now it's just the Westons and Rogers and Bell instead.

Some years ago when I first moved to my farm out here in the Hamilton area there was a meeting about zoning bylaws, as the city was finally -- after 20 years -- harmonizing the rural zoning laws after the municipal amalgamation that Mike Harris had forced on them back in the late 90s.

We're on an A1 zoned farm lot, and I have a small hobby vineyard here, and although I don't have enough acreage myself to run a winery business, I was curious to see what the zoning around that was. But then I noticed that they had language in the zoning laws that explicitly restricted all winery / commercial vineyard operations to be only in the east of the city (Winona, east of Stoney Creek). I was baffled why they would restrict like that, actually have laws preventing you from running a business up here.

So I went to the zoning presentations / meetings and tried to talk to the city staff there about it. She looked at me completely incredulously like I was from Mars.

"That's because that's where the wineries are. Maybe we'd allow cider operations up there, but not wine."

Why on earth would you go out of your way to do that? If someone wants to try it, why stop them? She just took it for granted that their job was to enshrine the existing state of things in a formal law.

It's for some reason just the default Canadian mindset to create an environment to often favour the already entrenched, and to explicitly put gates in front of any upstarts.

It's not a partisan thing. It's not liberal vs conservative vs whatever. It's just some weird mindset that wants to see credentials for everything, and the best credential you can have is your proximity to already existing power privilege or wealth.

Best explanation I have is this is an outcropping of the colonial mindset.

Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's partisan to deny your country is falling to shit just because you voted for the parties that made it fall to shit.

Their comment was directly, overtly partisan. Further, it plies the rhetoric of a partisan -- literally, every talking point directly from conservative Canada-land -- and then does the cliche "whataboutism" that is a signature. This whataboutism is a go-to because it's universally usable, and is the biggest tell that you're dealing with a partisan spouting worthless noise. Anything the government of the day does, wha…

No offence but you’re the one coming off as having a partisan agenda

Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#103

The country has just slipped into a recession (only one in g20 btw), food bank usage is at record highs, it's young adults are ranked 71st in the world in happiness (boomers in the top 10 tho), housing is out of reach for many, youth unemployment is at ~15%, outside investments are non-existent, government debt is at record levels, haven't won the Stanley cup in decades, in a trade war with the USA, nobody is startin…

Foreign investments just hit an 18 year high. Employment numbers just went positive (at about 5x the per capita rate of the US). The country is recovering nicely from being addicted to mass immigration/housing. Export markets are rapidly diversifying, and Canada has made a number of new strategic partnerships. Two straight months of growing trade surpluses. All while our largest trading partner explicitly and openly…

> And who gives a flying fuck about the Stanley cup. What a weird thing to cite.

If I was PM I would prioritise tax cuts to athletes playing for Canadian teams, repurpose the new Major Projects Office to be the Athletic Performance Office to provide funding and support to Canadian teams, and install a tax on Canadian players on American teams. I'm also joking, lighten up :P

I did misspeak about the foreign investments, what I was referring to is that we are seeing much more investments leaving the country than what are coming in, and of the investments in Canada, it's not just the sheer volume and direction that matters - foreign firms buying out Canadian businesses to later move them out of the country isn't a good thing long-term.

I have no doubt that Carney will be better for the economy than the last 10 years under Trudeau, and I hope they spend more time focusing on that then spending billions on useless gun buybacks, surveillance bills, banning social media, etc. We saw a sharp drop in entrepreneurship in Q1, hopefully they can do something to reverse that. I doubt it though.

Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#104

There is not enough noise about this bill. It's horrific. If you're Canadian, call your MP and raise a stink. The Liberals need to be shown quite explicitly by people in our profession how this will harm our industry, in addition to harming the privacy rights of our citizens; and it seems like conservatives are not planning on opposing this bill (just want it split in half) and the NDP is the only party raising real…

The Liberals have been elected 4 times in a row. They don't even hide the fact they're hostile to the needs and cares of Canadian citizens since we're the idiots who keep electing them. CBC pushes some propaganda about how this'll protect the kids, some brain-dead liberals will keep repeating it, Canada will just continue its path to irrelevancy...

The system is pretty fucked. You have the liberals (who are conservatives), the conservatives (who are increasingly taking inspiration from America but have always been even further right than the liberals), and the NDP who are unfortunately now rather irrelevant and also have a tendency to focus too much on identity politics.

If Trudeau had actually pushed for election reform like he'd promised to, maybe we'd be in a better place. But people forgave him for that because he made weed legal...

Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#105

what is bill c 22 in a nutshell for non canadians like me ? is this like the patriot act in usa ?

Its far worse than the Patriot Act. Its legislation that attempts to weaken and break encryption so that law enforcement and others can access encrypted communications. It also seeks to require mandatory suspicionless metadata for all online services. The legislation was explicitly written to target both telecom companies and every online service. Citizen Lab has a good writeup on the legislation here: https://citize…

The collection of metadata is almost certainly bad for people even if they do nothing wrong. It can (and will) be sold if regulations and enforcement are not airtight. It will almost certainly be leaked as a result of incompetence, negligence, or outright criminality. The only way to prevent your metadata from getting out into the great unknown is to ensure it isn't collected in the first place.

If you don't see what the big deal is, I suggest you consider the recent leak of voter data in Alberta. For those unfamiliar, a list of eligible voters is routinely shared with political parties for the purposes of running their election campaigns. One of those parties, the "Republican Party of Alberta", shared their copy of the list with separatists, who made it freely available to any of their pals. What's the big deal you ask? Who cares if their address is public knowledge? Isn't this the sort of thing that used to be in phonebooks? Just for one example, anyone who has moved away from an abusive ex now has to worry about their address, phone number, etc. being made available to that abusive ex. Privacy isn't just important for people who like wearing pants.

C-22 is supposed to protect Canadians but, instead, it endangers them. This is a bad bill.

Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#106

The country has just slipped into a recession (only one in g20 btw), food bank usage is at record highs, it's young adults are ranked 71st in the world in happiness (boomers in the top 10 tho), housing is out of reach for many, youth unemployment is at ~15%, outside investments are non-existent, government debt is at record levels, haven't won the Stanley cup in decades, in a trade war with the USA, nobody is startin…

Foreign investments just hit an 18 year high. Employment numbers just went positive (at about 5x the per capita rate of the US). The country is recovering nicely from being addicted to mass immigration/housing. Export markets are rapidly diversifying, and Canada has made a number of new strategic partnerships. Two straight months of growing trade surpluses. All while our largest trading partner explicitly and openly…

[flagged]

Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#107
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Foreign investments just hit an 18 year high. Employment numbers just went positive (at about 5x the per capita rate of the US). The country is recovering nicely from being addicted to mass immigration/housing. Export markets are rapidly diversifying, and Canada has made a number of new strategic partnerships. Two straight months of growing trade surpluses. All while our largest trading partner explicitly and openly…

The comment you've replied to is clearly not "partisan bluster". While it may be a tad hyperbolic, with the Stanley Cup line, it's driving a valid point that while Canada is facing a number of very real challenges, the government in power is spending its time on internet censorship bills. These bills are of almost no benefit to the average Canadian, and the point is that the government should focus more on things tha…

> while Canada is facing a number of very real challenges, the government in power is spending its time on internet censorship bills.

You could have said this at any point in the last ~15-20 years and it would apply. It's a problem certainly but not a new problem and has little to do with the current government nor current issues. They will try and try again until they succeed.

Instead of arguing over these semantics we should be focusing on a more permanent measure of preventing this garbage from getting inevitable shoved down our throats.

Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the tyranny of the majority. Ontario and Quebec together are like 65% of Canadians. I'm in BC and have made my peace with that. I would imagine people in PEI feel a similar way. Probably people living in Hope or Quesnel also feel similar about being steamrolled by Metro Vancouver and Victoria.

I get that Quebec and Ontario have 65% of the population, but why do they have 100% of the seats on a committee that shoves surveillance and gun bans down everyone else’s throats?

Not a clue, but if there are only 7 seats then all 10 provinces can't be represented anyway. I highly doubt political opinions about surveillance are aligned with provincial borders.

Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#109

the odd thing about it to me is that other than passports, all regular identity documents in Canada are issued by the provinces under specific mandates and regulations, which means that the provinces could choose not to endorse the usage of their IDs for age verification to foreign providers. Other than passports, the government of canada does not have an identity card to base any kind of sweeping electronic age veri…

Bill C-22 is the Canadian government's attempt to require encryption backdoors and mandatory data retention, for all online services.

The invasive mandatory age verification requires are part of bill C-34, which was just tabled yesterday. Its obviously an unacceptable violate of privacy, but the Liberals are far closer to passing C-22 at the moment.

Re: Petition to Withdraw Canada's Bill C-22

#110
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because US has far better opportunities and more money. My personal experience in doing business in Canada: each industry is monopolized by two or three companies, you need to get their “blessing” before you can do anything in that sector. Government contracts aren’t much, but even with that, it’s nepotism based, you will get a contract knowing someone who will indirectly get benefits from you, for example you will h…

Yep, ever the same since the Hudsons Bay Company and the Northwest Company ran the whole place. Now it's just the Westons and Rogers and Bell instead. Some years ago when I first moved to my farm out here in the Hamilton area there was a meeting about zoning bylaws, as the city was finally -- after 20 years -- harmonizing the rural zoning laws after the municipal amalgamation that Mike Harris had forced on them back…

> It's not a partisan thing. It's not liberal vs conservative vs whatever. It's just some weird mindset that wants to see credentials for everything, and the best credential you can have is your proximity to already existing power privilege or wealth.

Bingo, you nailed it! I like how you described it in few words as I have been trying to articulate that for a while, as some people I know they blame it in liberal or whatever, but the reality it has nothing to do with that, it’s just the overall mindset in here. A lot of people here like to hate on Americans or at least have an anti-American identity somehow, but the reality is, Americans are miles better when it comes to practicality of work, diversity of thoughts, and openness to new opportunities. My friend who owns a big drone company in the US told me before how he started the company years ago, it sounds like a movie where all you needed is some determination only, he had zero money and zero connections zero VC investors, and started it after being rejected on something related. Meanwhile it’s almost impossible to achieve that in Canada the same way how he started it. Add to that, Canadian economy is mostly services and real-estate, so anything outside of these two must be directly or indirectly sponsored by one of the companies you mentioned. It’s funny because while doing my business I ended up either that I have to be “blessed” by rogers or bell to actually get going :)

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