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Ask HN: Why is the HN crowd so anti-AI?

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Re: Ask HN: Why is the HN crowd so anti-AI?

#101

Post by CoffeeSky »

I actually felt the opposite. HN is full of AI crowd.

> Let’s face it: by the time I manually ship version 1.0 of a product, the AI-assisted version could have been deployed 10x faster. By then, enough real-world feedback would have surfaced to identify the major issues, and tools like Claude Code would make it possible to fix and ship version 2.0 at an incredible pace.

This precisely why I still have mixed reaction towards AI, even AI can produce functional code but might be filled with foot guns. I personally don't use AI (the full automated ones, e.g., Claude code, Codex, Cursor) but also I don't complain about people using AI.

This also reminds me of Jonathan Blow's Software is in Decline[1] talk. Even when the humans coded everything, we gave up on quality a long ago for speed. So people complaining about low quality AI code is ignored.

Simply put software engineering is not as rigorous as other engineering and most of the time when software ultimately fail there isn't major consequences.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeAMiBKi_EM

Re: Ask HN: Why is the HN crowd so anti-AI?

#102

Post by jhbadger »

kentich wrote: post #85

They called it AI instead of calling it neural networks and therefore provoked unrealistic expectations for this technology. Criticism will never end because of the fraudulent naming of this technology.

The field has been named "Artificial Intelligence" since the 1950s, It has nothing to do with neural nets per se. It just is about systems that do what was previously thought to be only something people could do. Traditionally the big names in the field like Minsky actually despised neural nets -- Minsky even wrote a book called Perceptrons (1969) which trashed the early version of neural nets and discouraged most research on them for a couple of decades.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the HN crowd so anti-AI?

#104

Post by jdw64 »

I have similar thoughts a lot. Actually, bugs and technical debt existed even when humans wrote the code. However, while low‑level layer coders might oppose AI interfering with their 'artwork,' someone like me, who mainly assembles libraries like Lego bricks on top of frameworks, would probably find LLMs useful.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the HN crowd so anti-AI?

#105

Post by kranner »

voidfunc wrote: post #83
zmmmmm wrote: post #75

I tend to agree with your overall point, but I think you reveal far more about yourself than you accurately reflect anything about HN. Just read back what you wrote: > AI-assisted version could have been deployed 10x faster. By then, enough real-world feedback would have surfaced to identify the major issues You want to ship major bugs to your users, let them find them, report them and fix them afterwards. You passiv…

If everyone does it and the majority of users are captured in ways that they wont or cant seek out alternatives then shipping bugs to users, letting them find amd report them and then fixing them is business-optimal.

It would potentially be more business-optimal to ship fewer bugs if everyone else is shipping more bugs. Your development cycle would be costlier, but users would prefer to buy your products over others.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the HN crowd so anti-AI?

#107

Post by atmavatar »

beej71 wrote: post #29
datadrivenangel wrote: post #8

Because AI use correlates with sloppiness, and due to the fundamental attribution fallacy us engineers don't like sloppiness.

This is a lot of it for me. "All users care about is that they can drive a car across the bridge. They don't care if an AI built it." I want a solid, proud, well-engineered bridge, goddammit!

Many users may not care which bridges they drive over, but I personally would like to avoid driving over the original Tacoma Narrows bridge[1] or any others of similarly flimsy engineering.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tacoma_Narrows_Bridge_(1940)

Re: Ask HN: Why is the HN crowd so anti-AI?

#108

Post by fcatalan »

voidfunc wrote: post #83
zmmmmm wrote: post #75

I tend to agree with your overall point, but I think you reveal far more about yourself than you accurately reflect anything about HN. Just read back what you wrote: > AI-assisted version could have been deployed 10x faster. By then, enough real-world feedback would have surfaced to identify the major issues You want to ship major bugs to your users, let them find them, report them and fix them afterwards. You passiv…

If everyone does it and the majority of users are captured in ways that they wont or cant seek out alternatives then shipping bugs to users, letting them find amd report them and then fixing them is business-optimal.

Skipping airplane maintenance is business-optimal for an airline. For a few months.

Re: Ask HN: Why is the HN crowd so anti-AI?

#109

Post by johnfn »

dang wrote: post #14

It's simply divided. With every such division A vs. B, the A team thinks HN is anti-A and the B team thinks it's anti-B. This is an invariant. You can see from the following megathread, currently on the front page, that HN is by no means anti-AI: Ask HN: What was your "oh shit" moment with GenAI? - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48406174 . Sometimes it just takes the right initial condition (e.g. title) to brin…

While I agree that it's "divided", I wouldn't say "simply". Mentioning AI brings out a sharply negative side of HN that I had not seen before 2023. It is the only subject where, when I have shared that I built something with it, I have gotten derogatory comments claiming I am inexperienced, unintelligent, and that the thing I built (a hobby project) is unimpressive or embarrassing. This has never happened in the decade+ I have previously been on HN, happily sharing other things I built with other interesting technology -- and many of those things were much worse than what I built with AI!

I did see your thread earlier today and I admit was pleasantly surprised. Maybe HN is turning over a new leaf? I hope so. I honestly considered switching to X it was getting so bad :P

Re: Ask HN: Why is the HN crowd so anti-AI?

#110

Post by ares623 »

voidfunc wrote: post #83
zmmmmm wrote: post #75

I tend to agree with your overall point, but I think you reveal far more about yourself than you accurately reflect anything about HN. Just read back what you wrote: > AI-assisted version could have been deployed 10x faster. By then, enough real-world feedback would have surfaced to identify the major issues You want to ship major bugs to your users, let them find them, report them and fix them afterwards. You passiv…

If everyone does it and the majority of users are captured in ways that they wont or cant seek out alternatives then shipping bugs to users, letting them find amd report them and then fixing them is business-optimal.

Pathetic state of affairs that this is said with a straight face. Jesus Christ. Software engineers deserve every hate that's coming for us.
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