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Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

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Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#101

Post by raincole »

tjwebbnorfolk wrote: post #47
mrtksn wrote: post #27

The only thing that can “save Europe” is US embargo, otherwise doesn’t make sense to do replication of the US effort whatsoever. In US the AI is a private effort, in Europe there are no businesses that are interested in investing such large amounts of money when they can benefit from US made AI. In China they don’t have this option to use the US offerings so they must invest, be it the government or the business that…

The hilarious irony is that Trump has been yelling at Europe since ~2017 to stop being so reliant on the US for everything, to pay more for its own defense, stop regulating and start innovating, etc. Basically everything that's in the Draghi report. Meanwhile, EU bureaucrats' heads appear to remain firmly buried in the sand.

Another hilarious fact: Trump has warned about Nord Stream 2, called it "a tool of coercion."[0] At this point it almost seems like Trump cares Europe more than EU leaders.

[0]: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-50879435

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#102

Post by insane_dreamer »

Insanity wrote: post #26

As a European I want mistral and EU to do well. But at the same time, I wouldn’t actually give up my well paid engineering job outside of EU to even entertain working for them in EU. Too low salaries and too high taxes.

you get much more for your taxes than in the US though

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#103

Post by tjwebbnorfolk »

mrtksn wrote: post #62
tjwebbnorfolk wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The hilarious irony is that Trump has been yelling at Europe since ~2017 to stop being so reliant on the US for everything, to pay more for its own defense, stop regulating and start innovating, etc. Basically everything that's in the Draghi report. Meanwhile, EU bureaucrats' heads appear to remain firmly buried in the sand.

EU isn’t governed by the china communist party, the only way to stop being reliant to US is to stop trade with US and the cost of it will be enormous. Trump needs to create such a high political risk that the economic damage be justified. He definitely did a lot to help, but the damage needs to be irreparable so that business can feel safe from US competition. He needs to do do something so outrageous that Germany wo…

I think one could argue that he tried this "the easy way" in his first term. He vented against Nord Stream with NATO, he vented against the regulations and the energy dependence and closing the nuke reactors. But he didn't actually do anything about it.

The difference now is that he's turning the screws and putting the pressure on. Call this "the hard way". I can understand why EU leaders do not like this one bit. But also, they had their chance...

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#104

Post by jmyeet »

mrtksn wrote: post #80
jmyeet wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The China example was such a massive blunder (from the perspective of US soft power). Like you say, it created a captive market for Chinese chips where Chinese companies might've otherwise bought foreign chips. That's inbuilt demand. But China also has something Europe doesn't and that's central planning. China has realized that chipmaking and AI are issues of national security. Europe just doesn't have that level of…

> don't see fascist takeovers in the UK, France or Germany The horseshoe theory is in full swing lately, in UK after right wing libertarian rule came the left wing labour and now it’s once again the right wingers. They again won’t solve anything and more swings will happen until someone realizes that it’s the US trade that isn’t working. The rest of Europe is similar, they just happen to have more damping as most hav…

I just have to respond to this: I'm not sure how you meant this but, to be clear, horseshow theory is BS.

For one thing, there's nothing remotely left wing about Starmer's Labor government. Labor is firmly a center-right party. So were the Blair and Brown governments. So we've had unbroken right-wing rule in the UK since Thatcher was elected almost 50 years ago.

If Jeremy Corbyn had been elected, he may well have been a left-wing PM but he wasn't. Instead, the threat of that caused Labor insiders to engage in a vile character assassination scheme that brought Keir Starmer to power, all to support US imperialism. There's nothing remotely left-wing about that.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#105

Post by gizmondo »

stavros wrote: post #78
jstummbillig wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you divorce being a European principally from being willing to pay taxes? What part of being uniquely European do you value that does not fundamentally require taxes?

I have to say, I visited Zurich once, and everything was clean, organized, civilized, and pretty. Friends told me taxes are high but you get great education, great healthcare, decent disposable income, and good transportation. If you get laid off, the state continues paying your previous salary for one (two?) years. If everything is taken care of me from taxes, why do I need money? Take it all.

Switzerland is the closest you can get to USA without leaving Europe. Taxes in Zurich are lower than in the Bay Area, at will employment, healthcare that is primarily funded by flat fees rather than income tax, etc. Even the constitution was originally inspired by the American one.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#106

Post by logicchains »

trinix912 wrote: post #61
moomoo11 wrote: post #46

i always forget EU exists when it comes to tech they’re so hostile to it (lawfare) and have seemingly little innovation comparatively why is that?

Because most people in the EU outside of the tech field care more about the welfare policies and overall quality of life than some ambitious tech projects of a few random private companies, from which they're unlikely to directly benefit from, especially when those are located outside of their member state.

Overall quality of life goes down if you just keep cutting up the pie without growing it, especially when you go into debt to buy more pie. The current youth in Europe are the first generation in decades to see worse living standards than their parents; Europeans' disdain for economic growth is already catching up with them.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#107

Post by NitpickLawyer »

bdangubic wrote: post #24
janice1999 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Americans are just as regulated and with even more egregious regulatory capture (see the American broadband/mobile provider cartel). At least Europeans get a little consumer protection.

america regulates to ensure companies (as few as humanly possible) profit while europe regulates to protect the consumers. the core difference, yea! and americans seemed to be always shitting on europe completely oblivious of what is being done to them, for decades now

> while europe regulates to protect the consumers

I get what you're trying to say, but having just had some meetings on aligning with the latest AI act, as a small startup focusing on adapting open source models for local use, the way it looks now, it seems like we won't have any consumers worth protecting :) (and I'm only half joking. AI act is a joke, and Mistral have been saying this for a while now. We have chinese models launched with permissive licenses, usable everywhere except in the EU. It'd be good comedy if it wouldn't be tragic. ffs! We can't use open source shit!!! It's bananas)

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#108

Post by nperson »

adev_ wrote: post #49
polski-g wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Power is 2-3x as expensive in Europe than American. They're toast.

> Power is 2-3x as expensive in Europe than American. They're toast. Europe is not Germany. Electricity price is 2-3x times more expensive in Germany. Electricity price for electricity intensive professional is around 12-14cts/kWh in France and can be reduce under 10cts/kWh for big consummers. Which is competitive with the cost in several US states (it is still higher than Texas but not 3x). Nordic countries should b…

Electricity price in Germany for industries was ~16,7ct/kWh in 2026, special ones pay 11-12ct today and will pay a capped 5ct soon.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#109

Post by rdm_blackhole »

tlogan wrote: post #81
Insanity wrote: post #26

As a European I want mistral and EU to do well. But at the same time, I wouldn’t actually give up my well paid engineering job outside of EU to even entertain working for them in EU. Too low salaries and too high taxes.

But working in UE gives you much stronger job protection. So, in a way, you get what you pay for.

But that is a the problem though. You get stronger job protection because its very hard to find a job. If you could find a new job quickly and if the job market was more fluid, you would only rarely need this sort of job protection.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#110

Post by kuschku »

rdm_blackhole wrote: post #79
jstummbillig wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you divorce being a European principally from being willing to pay taxes? What part of being uniquely European do you value that does not fundamentally require taxes?

Not OP but to respond to your question, like everything, there is a scale to this question. Would you give to the state 30% of your income to pay for public services? Most people would say yes. What about 40%? 50%? Most people agree that taxes need to be paid for the common good of society. However, many people disagree about the correct amount and increasingly about the usage of said taxes. That is the real problem…

> Would you give to the state 30% of your income to pay for public services? Most people would say yes. What about 40%? 50%?

I pay about 6% for public services, around 8% for health insurance, and around 25% for the public pension insurance. The issue isn't taxes, it's almost entirely demographics.

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