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Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

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Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#101

Post by gib444 »

amunozo wrote: post #92
SoftTalker wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can exist, but life will be as inconvenient as it was in the 1990s (though importantly, it didn't seem inconvenient at the time, it was just the way things were).

I disagree. You cannot even book appointments in a lot of banks today, a thing you could do in the 90s. Like that, a lot of services are unavailable without a smartphone and its non-smartphone equivalent is not available anymore.

I walked into my bank the other day and sorted out something, without an appointment.

Just joined an informal queue (no digital queueing system! The humans used their eyes and brain to remember who next )

Handed over my physical debit card so they could locate my account.

What digital hellscape do you live in? UK here

Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#102

Post by gib444 »

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #76

The challenge isn't buying it, the challenge is being able to do phone things with it. Nowadays, you can no longer exist in society without a phone. Most things will work but it takes one critical service that doesn't have a viable workaround, and you're forced to buy (and possibly carry) a "mainstream" phone just for that. Banking, government, authentication, postal service and public transit apps are just some of t…

> Nowadays, you can no longer exist in society without a phone

If my phone breaks, I will die? :)

Perhaps it's this spreading of this lie that it's impossible to live without a phone that is contributing to the problem

Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#103

Post by willio58 »

bdangubic wrote: post #95
amunozo wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. You cannot even book appointments in a lot of banks today, a thing you could do in the 90s. Like that, a lot of services are unavailable without a smartphone and its non-smartphone equivalent is not available anymore.

Why does this permeate the HN all the time. You can 100% function without a fucking smartphone. My Dad doesn’t have one, he has zero-to-no trouble going to the bank and paying his bills and just about every other imaginable thing. If there was something he could not do and there were repercussions for it he’d be calling an attorney to rectify the situation. It is crazy to keep reading this over and over on HN, so wei…

Yep, many older people right now don’t have a smart phone and never will.

As long as some younger people stay that course we should be fine. Hopefully we’ll see an increase of dumb phone adoption in a growing cohort younger adults. But the FUD spread in threads like this actually spreads misinformation and makes that less likely to happen

Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#104

Post by epolanski »

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #76

The challenge isn't buying it, the challenge is being able to do phone things with it. Nowadays, you can no longer exist in society without a phone. Most things will work but it takes one critical service that doesn't have a viable workaround, and you're forced to buy (and possibly carry) a "mainstream" phone just for that. Banking, government, authentication, postal service and public transit apps are just some of t…

How about a second phone for the things you list?

Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#105

Post by logicchains »

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #76

The challenge isn't buying it, the challenge is being able to do phone things with it. Nowadays, you can no longer exist in society without a phone. Most things will work but it takes one critical service that doesn't have a viable workaround, and you're forced to buy (and possibly carry) a "mainstream" phone just for that. Banking, government, authentication, postal service and public transit apps are just some of t…

I'd wager the majority of people on this site could afford $100-$200 for a separate phone that's solely used for apps that mandate Google/Apple services. As a bonus, using the "mainstream" phone with only those apps increases security, compared to having your banking apps on the same phone as other random apps.

Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#106

Post by pjmlp »

bdangubic wrote: post #95
amunozo wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. You cannot even book appointments in a lot of banks today, a thing you could do in the 90s. Like that, a lot of services are unavailable without a smartphone and its non-smartphone equivalent is not available anymore.

Why does this permeate the HN all the time. You can 100% function without a fucking smartphone. My Dad doesn’t have one, he has zero-to-no trouble going to the bank and paying his bills and just about every other imaginable thing. If there was something he could not do and there were repercussions for it he’d be calling an attorney to rectify the situation. It is crazy to keep reading this over and over on HN, so wei…

In Portugal you have to do that at the bank terminals, otherwise going to the counter implies paying a services tax, depending on the kind of customer one happens to be.

Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#107

Post by logicchains »

echelon wrote: post #40
janvlug wrote: post #13

I use a Librem5 Linux phone. With the default PureOS operating system. Enjoy your freedom, break free from Google and Apple. Have a full Linux computer in your pocket that you can also use for calling. See also the discussion on this post: https://mastodon.social/@janvlug/116504044251287290

> Enjoy your freedom, break free from Google and Apple. You can't escape it. Your friends and employers and banks use it. The state will soon mandate it for ID. It's the accepted worldwide compute platform, and you're being the nail that sticks out. Your usage is subject to breaking randomly, being unsupported, losing access or being banned by stepping outside the traffic lines, etc. They'll use attestation, certs an…

>Your friends and employers and banks use it. The state will soon mandate it for ID.

You just buy a separate, cheap Android/Google phone for all these things. Emphasis on buying the cheapest one possible, so Google and Apple aren't making much money off you.

Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#108

Post by epolanski »

amunozo wrote: post #92
SoftTalker wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can exist, but life will be as inconvenient as it was in the 1990s (though importantly, it didn't seem inconvenient at the time, it was just the way things were).

I disagree. You cannot even book appointments in a lot of banks today, a thing you could do in the 90s. Like that, a lot of services are unavailable without a smartphone and its non-smartphone equivalent is not available anymore.

This.

1. My bank doesn't allow to go in person without an in-app taken appointment.

2. My nephew can't play football in his team, because the team has an app to book/signal your availability. No other way.

3. Half of restaurants in my area do not have non-QR code menus, they just don't.

4. McDonald's will make me pay the scam pricing you get without the app.

5. My doctor gives documentation only and exclusively in digital form, on a special application that doesn't even have a desktop equivalent.

6. My fiance's office badges are smartphone-based. You cannot enter otherwise.

7. All the software she uses at work requires frequent Google/Apple/third party authentication.

8. Increasingly more European airlines exclusively accept in-app check in and documentation. You cannot print it. Ryanair's one of them.

I could go on for longer.

Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#109

Post by spankibalt »

bdangubic wrote: post #95
amunozo wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. You cannot even book appointments in a lot of banks today, a thing you could do in the 90s. Like that, a lot of services are unavailable without a smartphone and its non-smartphone equivalent is not available anymore.

Why does this permeate the HN all the time. You can 100% function without a fucking smartphone. My Dad doesn’t have one, he has zero-to-no trouble going to the bank and paying his bills and just about every other imaginable thing. If there was something he could not do and there were repercussions for it he’d be calling an attorney to rectify the situation. It is crazy to keep reading this over and over on HN, so wei…

> "Why does this permeate the HN all the time."

It's a bias, an in-bubble illiteracy effect, concerning the perception and analysis of realities (e. g. experiences) outside that bubble, mirroring an in-group's projections about an out-group. It is, in my decades of experience, a very common phenomenon in the IT sector.

> "My Dad doesn’t have one, he has zero-to-no trouble going to the bank and paying his bills and just about every other imaginable thing."

So far, that holds true for me as well (Germany).

> "If there was something he could not do and there were repercussions for it he’d be calling an attorney to rectify the situation."

The crux: the increasing friction brought on by rising technological entry barriers. In Germany you have at least the non-exclusion principle of Teilhabe (lit.: participation) which gives certain guarantees. But such achievements of democracy are continually under fire.

Re: Where to buy a non-Apple, non-Google smartphone

#110

Post by pjmlp »

ALLTaken wrote: post #81

Sounds very much like HarmonyOS. I was just in a Huawei Store and I think from a UI/UX perspective, despite being quite new, it's incredibly slick and leaps ahead in great design and integration within the HarmonyOS ecosystem. Even saw it being used as Laptop OS and Mobile, the convergence is quite applaudable. The kindest was that the store's staff advised against buying the device as it's quite painful to use it wi…

The next version of it, HarmonyOS NEXT is microkernel based, and they have two new languages of their own.

ArkTS, inspired in Typescript and similar nodejs runtime.

Naturally due to performance problems, they decided to come up with another one, also Typescript inspired, but ahead of time compiled, GC and effects.

It is called Canjgie.

This naturally is a big effort rebooting the whole ecosystem, it only works because Huawei could focus on the Chinese market after losing Android.

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