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Nightingale – open-source karaoke app that works with any song on your computer

nightingale.cafe

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Re: Nightingale – open-source karaoke app that works with any song on your computer

#101

Post by Gormo »

throw_await wrote: post #100
raincole wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> instead of checking for what's already installed Plenty of software come with their own Python runtime. Even Blender uses its own Python runtime. I can name so many apps with embedded Python runtime: Blender, Houdini, Bitwig, Substance Painter, Krita, etc. Checking for what's already installed isn't the norm. In Krita's case, it uses installed Python to build it... and in the building process it builds another Pyth…

All reasonable Linux distro will patch these stupid things to usw the system interpreter.

And even if the build scripts are downloading deps, having the application itself install dependencies to the user's home directory at runtime is unheard of.

Re: Nightingale – open-source karaoke app that works with any song on your computer

#102

Post by user34283 »

bheadmaster wrote: post #80
user34283 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt that you know the OP's background and knowledge. If someone on here would direct at me the insinuation that a flaw in my software was the result of me having "no idea" about what I am doing, we would not be having a civil discussion. In my view personal attacks should be flagged, but I don't have that ability because my account does not have enough Karma.

Look at the commit history. Vibe coded in 10 days, with obvious AI generated commit messages. Look at the diffs. If you can't tell AI slop from handwritten code, that's your problem. I won't censor myself because of your opinions.

There is no need for me to look at "obvious AI generated commit messages" or check whether the code is handwritten.

Personal attacks are still against the rules of this site, and that's why you, or in this case the commenter before you, should have censored themselves. This is not a matter of opinions.

Re: Nightingale – open-source karaoke app that works with any song on your computer

#103

Post by Gormo »

marssaxman wrote: post #72
Gormo wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s a desktop app for mostly non-technical users, so bundling the runtime is a deliberate tradeoff to reduce setup friction and machine-specific breakage. That's not a very reasonable justification, considering that dynamic linking of dependencies has been industry standard in software designed for "non-technical users" for the past thirty years or so, and is basically a solved problem. I can understand having a d…

> dynamic linking of dependencies has been industry standard So it has, and I've been hating the excess complexity it brings for most of that thirty years! I'm glad to see the recent swing back toward self-contained executables. Where this author went wrong was not in vendoring the app's exact dependencies, which is a good idea, but in trying to download them and install them separately on first launch, rather than i…

> So it has, and I've been hating the excess complexity it brings for most of that thirty years!

It reduces complexity compared to the administrative and security mess of every application having its own version of every library, let alone its own version of external tools and interpreters.

> I'm glad to see the recent swing back toward self-contained executables.

I wish there was one. Static linking is a great solution for this. Instead, we're seeing dynamically linked libraries being bundled alongside of executables in a way that increases complexity vastly.

> Where this author went wrong was not in vendoring the app's exact dependencies, which is a good idea, but in trying to download them and install them separately on first launch, rather than including them in the app bundle, where they can remain isolated from the rest of the system.

Agreed. Dependency resolution at build time is normal. Dependency resolution in user mode at runtime is crazy.

Re: Nightingale – open-source karaoke app that works with any song on your computer

#105

Post by bheadmaster »

stavros wrote: post #98
bheadmaster wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AI slop is not a contribution.

[flagged]

Nice detective work in an attempt to... ridicule my programming skills, I suppose?

It's a useful tool and I built it myself, with my own ten fingers, using my brain. That's more than vibe coders will ever do.

Meanwhile, your blog says in big text "I don't care for the joy of programming", so I don't consider your opinions on software development anywhere near relevant.

Re: Nightingale – open-source karaoke app that works with any song on your computer

#108

Post by stavros »

bheadmaster wrote: post #105
stavros wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Nice detective work in an attempt to... ridicule my programming skills, I suppose? It's a useful tool and I built it myself, with my own ten fingers, using my brain. That's more than vibe coders will ever do. Meanwhile, your blog says in big text "I don't care for the joy of programming", so I don't consider your opinions on software development anywhere near relevant.

Excellent, on that we can agree.

Re: Nightingale – open-source karaoke app that works with any song on your computer

#109

Post by raincole »

throw_await wrote: post #100
raincole wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> instead of checking for what's already installed Plenty of software come with their own Python runtime. Even Blender uses its own Python runtime. I can name so many apps with embedded Python runtime: Blender, Houdini, Bitwig, Substance Painter, Krita, etc. Checking for what's already installed isn't the norm. In Krita's case, it uses installed Python to build it... and in the building process it builds another Pyth…

All reasonable Linux distro will patch these stupid things to usw the system interpreter.

It's not how it works. You can just install whichever linux distro of your favorite, download blender or krita, and see it uses its own python by default yourself.

And thankfully it's not how it works. If it were it'd break plugin ecosystems of many apps completely.

Re: Nightingale – open-source karaoke app that works with any song on your computer

#110

Post by Gormo »

charcircuit wrote: post #93
solvik wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a desktop app for mostly non-technical users, so bundling the runtime is a deliberate tradeoff to reduce setup friction and machine-specific breakage. That said, an optional “use system environment if available” mode could make sense for advanced users. A PR for that would be welcome, as long as it also handles the real complexity involved: platform differences, Python package compatibility, GPU backends, and mi…

Such a setting will cause more headaches for the developer since it explodes their support matrix. Supporting a single version of dependencies and shipping those is a much more scalable solution for delivering high quality software.

Quite the opposite, in fact: if the app gains popularity that people start looking to build and package it for their respective OSes or distribution channels, the author will be inundated with support requests on account of doing dependency management in such an unusual and risky way.

"Normal" users wouldn't even encounter anything here, as they'd just install prebuilt binary packages with all of the dependencies already sorted out. As things stand, the application trying to install its own dependencies at runtime is creating a whole new class of user-facing issues to generate escalations (such as the app's failure to locate the Python interpreter it itself had just installed).

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