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Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

anders.unix.se

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Re: Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

#101

Post by Towaway69 »

jsk2600 wrote: post #13
Zambyte wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you echoing?

Mostly tiling WMs and terminals

I remember those days, Fvwm2[1] was brilliant with its multiple screens and controlling the mouse using arrow keys - good times. Amazingly difficult to config even if you could get Xconfig to support your setup (external refresh rates and supported screen sizes and drivers for video cards).

But over the years I've come to appreciate the simplicity of Mac. Initially it didn't even have multiple screens but you could install (I forget the name) an application that simulated the multiple screens of Fvwm2. Right from the start I was glad for the simplicity of just having everything work or it wasn't supported - there was no in-between.

Today I'm using Spaces with iTerm2 and Emacs as core development tools. Not much different from my Fvwm2, xterm and Emacs in xterm solution from 25 years ago. Pity really that nothing has fundamentally changed in code development.

[1]: https://www.fvwm.org/

Re: Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

#103

Post by ekjhgkejhgk »

9dev wrote: post #93
mvdtnz wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Heavens, thank you. It’s like people assume genius when RMS wiggles his little toe and wonder what grand intellectual insight might have moved Him to do so.

Stallman has been right so many times, usually decades ahead of time. On each hype cycle when most of us were bewildering at the latest shiny thing, Stallman was spelling out exactly how companies would use it to exploit us. And I'm not talking about obvious garbage with zero upside like crypto and IoT, I'm talking about more subtle hype that actually did have a degree of upside, like the cloud or javascript for example. I think he deserves a little bit more respect than that. I'm not saying "lets suspend our critical thinking and just follow whatever RMS says", I'm saying "this guy has been decades ahead of time in the most fundamental matters like morality and justice, lets give his quirkness a little leeway".

Re: Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

#104

Post by [deleted] »

krackers wrote: post #25
jsk2600 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the guy who is 'browsing' web using wget+email afterall: > For personal reasons, I do not browse the web from my computer. (I also have not net connection much of the time.) To look at page I send mail to a demon which runs wget and mails the page back to me. It is very efficient use of my time, but it is slow in real time.

This makes sense if you want to reject the modern web, but using lynx or w3m would work as well. But if you generally want to champion free software and put the "personal" in PC, then I think you necessarily need to familiarize yourself with modern computing or else you can't really have a good opinion on it. For instance, if you refuse to play around with LLMs out of some dogmatic reason that they're not "truly" ope…

[deleted]

Re: Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

#105

Post by Shorel »

apetresc wrote: post #8

I completely misread '2015' as '2025' and thought these were from this November rather than November 10 years ago. I couldn't believe so many people were still using what appeared to be Aqua-era OS X.

I've never owned an Apple computer, and I still miss the Aqua-era OS X UI.

There was something magical about it.

Re: Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

#106

Post by ekjhgkejhgk »

zvmaz wrote: post #56
gentooflux wrote: post #3

RMS could have taken a photo of his screen, or done something cheeky like dump his screen to a padded ASCII text file and submitted that. Stick in the mud.

"I don't know how to make a screenshot" Linus Torvalds often says that he does not know how to do X (like install a Linux distribution, or other simple stuff). I wager that it's a status thing.

> I wager that it's a status thing.

Yes, it's a form of signaling. It's like a milloinaire showing "I have so much money that I can dump 10k on a Rolex and not even think about it", or a billionaire showing "I have so much money I don't even need to dump 10k on a Rolex to show how much money I have". These guy's version is "I'm so technically accomplished, that I can tell you I don't know X basic thing and you'll interpret it as a sign of my genius".

That's ok. In our society we attribute too much importance on money, I don't mind if the likes of Stallman and Linus get a bit more fanhood from the wider society than they currently do.

Re: Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

#107

Post by rightbyte »

ekjhgkejhgk wrote: post #41
rightbyte wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ye I need more pure hearted dogmatism in my life such that I can say that and don't lie. Have some secretary send me webpages with obfuscated JS by fax when I need to sin.

I get that you're being sarcastic, but I actually think the world would be a kinder place if we had more of Stallman's flavor of pure hearted dogmatism.

Ye I agree. I was not sarcastic other than that I must aknowledge that I probably wouldn't go to that length becouse of weakness in my heart ;)

Re: Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

#108

Post by pmontra »

gentooflux wrote: post #3

RMS could have taken a photo of his screen, or done something cheeky like dump his screen to a padded ASCII text file and submitted that. Stick in the mud.

Most likely that photo would have been on film in 2002. Shoot it, then wait to shoot all the pictures on the roll, bring the roll to a shop, get the prints, either scan the screenshot or mail it, with a stamp. A Polaroid would cut most of the wait time to zero. Anyway, still a lot of trouble compared to a few years later.

By the way, I think RMS doesn't have a mobile phone even now. Somebody's else could have taken a picture for him. Phones with cameras were not common back then because what would you do with it on GSM?

Re: Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

#109

Post by ekjhgkejhgk »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #96
zvmaz wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I don't know how to make a screenshot" Linus Torvalds often says that he does not know how to do X (like install a Linux distribution, or other simple stuff). I wager that it's a status thing.

It’s disdain.

Nah, I think he's right, it's signaling.

I think Linus and Stallman don't have disdain for "civilians". I think Linus in particular has deep disdain for people who pretend to be competent and then are not up to scrutiny; but he doesn't have those blowouts with dumbasses that he doesn't work with.

On the other hand, someone who strikes me has having universal disdain is Carmack.

Re: Screenshots from developers: 2002 vs. 2015 (2015)

#110

Post by myaccountonhn »

bigstrat2003 wrote: post #38
ajross wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think I see only one truly tiled layout. But yes, "terminals and editors" as the core developer workflow is extremely conserved over time. It dates from the mid 80's on Sun 2's and really hasn't changed much in four decades. It's probably not worth arguing whether this is the "best" when compared with vscode+LSP+Claude or whatever happens to be en vogue in the moment. But terminals and editors is sticky in a way th…

> But terminals and editors is sticky in a way that tells me it's probably close to optimal. Optimal for those users, at any rate. IMO using a terminal editor is so painful compared to a decent GUI (Sublime or even VSCode) that I have a difficult time understanding why anyone would choose such a tool. I just try to repeat the mantra of "everyone likes different things" and stop trying to understand something where I…

For me its how easy it is to extend. Kakoune makes it so easy to integrate with the rest of my system. I can often create any kind of integration I need with just 1-10 lines of code. In vscode I need to just hope that someone else built the integration I need as a plugin, because writing plugins is really painful.
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