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Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

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Re: Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

#101

Post by sedawkgrep »

niwtsol wrote: post #31
officeplant wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a feeling GM is going to keep making pushrod v8's until the eventual death of the internal combustion engine.

This comment made me question the specifics of my mental model pushrod vs overhead cam engine. I found this site that has three nice gif’s which was exactly what my visual brain wanted to see for comparing the differences - https://www.samarins.com/glossary/dohc.html Thanks for the comment as it was the impetus for me to expand my engine knowledge today!

Thanks for the link. Like you, it really helped me understand what's going on with all three of the designs shown.

Re: Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

#102

Post by olyjohn »

6SixTy wrote: post #85
officeplant wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair Ford's small turbos are also notorious for shitting the bed, but mostly due to cooling system failures or the terrible choice of still running a timing belt. (1.0L Ecoboost engines)

Ford's big mistake with the 1.0L Ecoboost wasn't exclusively using a timing belt, it was using a timing belt submerged in oil. They did state that they engineered the rubber to withstand being submerged in oil, but ultimately it didn't really work out like they had hoped.

Lol. The most insane thing about the 1.0 is that they switched back to a timing chain due to the belt issues. But guess what? The fuxking oil pump is still driven by a rubber belt submerged in oil... And guess what happens to the oil pump belt? Just mind blowing that they would half ass this fix so badly.

Re: Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

#103

Post by olyjohn »

Zak wrote: post #45
officeplant wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a feeling GM is going to keep making pushrod v8's until the eventual death of the internal combustion engine.

I used to view them with disdain - a clearly obsolete design GM kept using because they're cheap or lazy or some such. I no longer hold that view. GM's pushrod V8s are considerably smaller than their competition, and lightweight relative to their displacement, for which there is famously no replacement.

Turbos are the replacement for displacement.

Re: Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

#104

Post by olyjohn »

technothrasher wrote: post #34
supportengineer wrote: post #32

I’ve noticed Honda puts an emphasis on reducing stress. I have a 20 year old Honda which still runs fine because everything about it seems “overbuilt” - other owners say it runs fine without coolant, oil, etc - just keeps plugging along.

> other owners say it runs fine without coolant, oil, etc Um, no. Go ahead dump your oil and coolant, go drive your car, and report back how "fine" it did. (No, please don't actually do this. Although here's a guy who did, for the clicks. The Honda did impressively well, but it wasn't "fine". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyejT4VPzlE )

My friend ran his 1995 Civic about 40 miles with no coolant in it. It warped the head and blew the head gasket. But I skimmed the head, put in a new gasket and got another 50k out of it before selling it. It didn't have a single problem the whole time I had it.

Re: Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

#106

Post by 1970-01-01 »

veunes wrote: post #81
potato3732842 wrote: post #27

25yr is "meeting expectations" for any mass market[1] engine designed after about the mid 1970s or so. A design that is both not fundamentally flawed in some way and cutting edge enough for its time to not quickly rendered obsolete the steady increase in expectations should go far longer. A design that is "ok" and cutting edge will probably go 20-30yr. A design that is behind the times, and very good (easier to not m…

Plenty of engines hit the 20-year mark, but not many do it while still powering everything from family sedans to track-ready Type Rs

The V6 2GR is about to do it for Toyota. Subaru had the EJ going strong for 20 years. Honda has this. Nissan had a few contenders.. there's a list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ward%27s_10_Best_Engines

Re: Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

#107

Post by hephaes7us »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #91

"Engine failure" is something everyone thought was a last century problem, yet it's back. Some blame extra thin oils, and some are pointing to cheap parts (ex. plastic manifolds and plastic timing guides). There are now engine lawsuits in 2015-2025 model vehicles from all the big vehicle manufacturers, with new failures clustering in late models. They literally don't make them like they used to.

Intuitively I feel like it's something like the light bulb.

For a while, bulbs had to meet efficiency standards. These standards were configured such that they didn't technically exclude incandescent bulbs, however, for an incandescent bulb to comply, it would have to be driven hard and thus comparatively short-lived.

(for context, incandescent bulbs last something like 4x as long if you let them be 10% dimmer)

Re: Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

#108

Post by bch »

roflchoppa wrote: post #39
technothrasher wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> other owners say it runs fine without coolant, oil, etc Um, no. Go ahead dump your oil and coolant, go drive your car, and report back how "fine" it did. (No, please don't actually do this. Although here's a guy who did, for the clicks. The Honda did impressively well, but it wasn't "fine". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyejT4VPzlE )

Coolant sure, my RSX has a radiator leak for the past 2 years. Oil not so much.

I had a friend who had a Honda (edit: actually, Toyota iirc) for ~15 years that didn’t know it had oil; So when they sold it and was asked how often the oil was changed, the potential buyer was met with a quizzical look. Tires and gasoline and window washer fluid was its maintenance.

Re: Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

#109

Post by heelix »

TheCondor wrote: post #65
pmontra wrote: post #30

That's a series of engines, not a single model. The FIAT FIRE [1] series has been in production for 36 years from 1985 to 2021 and, maybe you wouldn't expect it from FIAT, those engines were reliable. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fully_Integrated_Robotised_Eng...

The Jag XK platform had 45+ year run. I'd bet that as long as the 911 is made, it'll have an inline 6 and to someone's thinking it will be the same platform as the air-cooled version from 1964. Engine architectures tend to last unless they are bad. They can do a lot on one also, the Toyota GR platform started out as a fairly vanilla V-6 but it has variations with GDI and variations with turbochargers and has been use…

Ah man, I owned a Jag XJS with the V12. Nothing on that car was what I'd consider 'normal'. Want to change the brake pads - down the rabbit hole I went. That car was why I own a voltmeter. I was a lot more knowledgeable after that car - smart enough to run, not walk from an XKE opportunity.

Re: Japanese four-cylinder engine is so reliable still in production after 25 years

#110

Post by bluGill »

jabl wrote: post #90
bluGill wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of my favorite tractors was the old Oil Pull's which were designed for oil in the radiator. (they were a gas engine, but designed to run on "tractor fuel" which is closer to diesel than gasoline - in order to work the engine had to be very hot)

It's of course possible to design engines to be oil cooled, though water-glycol tends to be preferred due to about twice the specific heat capacity, meaning smaller coolant channels, radiators, and fans are required.

I don't think it occurred to anyone in 1905 that a water/glycol mix might be good. They either used straight water with a warning to drain the engine when you shut down in cold weather so it didn't freeze, or they used oil. My 1939 tractor has instructions to start the engine and then pour water in the radiator when it is below freezing.
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