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SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

blog.kagi.com

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Re: SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

#101

Post by carlosjobim »

hananova wrote: post #97
carlosjobim wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are they using particular wordpress page setups and plugins that are common with SEO spammers? Why doesn't Kagi go after these signals instead? Then you could easily catch a double digit percentage of slop and maybe over half of slop (AI generated or not), without having to do crowd sourcing and other complicated setups. It's right there in the code. The same with emojis in YouTube video titles.

You’re responding to the Kagi ML lead. They are using those signals in addition to crowd sourcing.

Are you certain? I haven't seen this mentioned anywhere, except for now. And lot's of SEO WordPress spam is still showing up in Kagi queries.

Re: SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

#103

Post by blargey »

anal_reactor wrote: post #96
Kuiper wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a huge audience for AI-generated content on YouTube, though admittedly many of them are oblivious to the fact that they are watching AI-generated content. Here are several examples of videos with 1 million views that people don't seem to realize are AI-generated: * https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxvTjrsNtxA * https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfDnMpuSYic These videos do have some editing which I believe was d…

Hot take but I don't care if the content I consume is AI-generated or not. First of all, while sometimes I need high-effort quality content, sometimes I want my brain to rest and then AI-generated slop is completely okay. He who didn't binge-watch garbage reality TV can cast the first stone. Second, just because something is AI-generated it doesn't automatically mean it's slop, just like human-generated content isn't…

> He who didn't binge-watch garbage reality TV can cast the first stone

I'm not in a rock-throwing mood, but I qualify for that easily. False consensus effect cuts against AI...mass-production? aficionados just as much as hardline opponents.

Re: SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

#104

Post by NewsaHackO »

baggachipz wrote: post #26

"Begun, the slop wars have." I applaud any effort to stem the deluge of slop in search results. It's SEO spam all over again, but in a different package.

Ironically, the group that hates AI-generated content the most are the SEO bros. They hate that AI summaries in search results cut into their main business of making confusing, long-winded articles to attempt to entice the largest amount of clicks or view time for a one-sentence answer. I wouldn't be surprised if they are the ones actually behind pushes like this.

Re: SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

#105

Post by paradox460 »

Kuiper wrote: post #88
dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #76

So we have two universes. One is pushing generated content up our throats - from social media to operating systems - and another universe where people actively decide not to have anything to do with it. I wonder where the obstinacy on the part of certain CEOs come from. It's clear that although such content does have its fans (mostly grouped in communities), people at large just hate arificially-generated content. We…

There is a huge audience for AI-generated content on YouTube, though admittedly many of them are oblivious to the fact that they are watching AI-generated content. Here are several examples of videos with 1 million views that people don't seem to realize are AI-generated: * https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxvTjrsNtxA * https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfDnMpuSYic These videos do have some editing which I believe was d…

Reddit has been full of bad fake stories for ages. All that AI does is automate it

Re: SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

#106

Post by imiric »

input_sh wrote: post #28

The same company that slopifies news stories in their previous big "feature"? The irony.

Not all "AI"-generated content can be categorized as "slop". "Slop" has a specific meaning, usually associated with spam and low-effort content. What Kagi News is doing is summarizing news articles from different sources, and applying a custom structure and format. It is a branded product supported by a reputable company, not a low-effort spam site.

I'm a firm skeptic of the current hype around this technology, but I think it is foolish to think that it doesn't have good applications. Summarizing text content is one such use case, and IME the chances for the LLM to produce wrong content or hallucinate are very small. I've used Kagi News a number of times over the past few months, and I haven't spotted any content issues, aside from the tone and structure not quite matching my personal preferences.

Kagi is one of the few companies that is pragmatic about the positive and negative aspects of "AI", and this new feature is well aligned with their vision. It is unfair to criticize them for this specifically.

Re: SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

#107

Post by hastamelo »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #76

So we have two universes. One is pushing generated content up our throats - from social media to operating systems - and another universe where people actively decide not to have anything to do with it. I wonder where the obstinacy on the part of certain CEOs come from. It's clear that although such content does have its fans (mostly grouped in communities), people at large just hate arificially-generated content. We…

you have a very narrow definition of "people"

on Instagram AI content is highly popular, some videos have 50mil views and half a million likes

Re: SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

#108

Post by VHRanger »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #93
VHRanger wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, a fun fact about slop text is that it's very low perplexity text (basically: it's statistically likely text from an LLM's point of view) so most algorithms that rank will tend to have a bias towards preferring this text. Since even classical machine learning uses BERT based embeddings on the backend this problem is likely wider scale than it seems if a search engine isn't proactively filtering it out

> low perplexity text Is this a term of art? (How is perplexity different from complexity, colloquially, or entropy, particularly?)

Perplexity is a term of art in LLM training, yes.

A naive way of scoring how AI laden text is would be to run n-1 layers of a model and compare the text to the probability space of tokens from the model.

It works somewhat to detect obvious text but is not strong enough a method by itself.

Re: SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

#109

Post by Vegenoid »

cschep wrote: post #59
Brian_K_White wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your wife can't detect that you told your secretary to buy something nice, should she care?

This is an absurd comparison - you (presumably) made a commitment to your wife. There is no such commitment on a public blog?

There are many discussions of what sets apart a high trust society from a low trust society, and how a high trust society enables greater cooperation and positive risk taking collectively. Also about how the United States is currently descending into a low trust society.

"Random blog can do whatever they want and it's wrong of you to criticize them for anything because you didn't make a mutual commitment" is low-trust society behavior. I, and others, want there to be a social contract that it is frowned upon to violate. This social contract involves not being dishonest.

Re: SlopStop: Community-driven AI slop detection in Kagi Search

#110

Post by VHRanger »

sdoering wrote: post #98
VHRanger wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, Kagi ML lead here. > Kagi pays for hordes of reviewers? Is this another case of outsourcing moderation to sweat shops in poor countries? No, we're simply not paying for review of content at the moment, nor is it planned. We'll scale human review as needed with long time kagi users in our discord we already trust > Do the reviewers use state of the art tools to assist in confirming slop Mostly this, yes. For imag…

May I ask how you plan to deal with YouTube auto-dubbing videos into crappy AI slop? I wanted to watch a video and was taken aback by the abysmal ai generated voice. Only afterwards I realized YouTube had autogenerated the translated audio track. Destroyed the experience. And kills YouTube for me.

> May I ask how you plan to deal with YouTube auto-dubbing videos into crappy AI slop?

I'm sorry that's a YouTube problem, not a problem with the original content.

Sadly we don't have plans to address that at the moment -- otherwise all of youtube would be labeled slop

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