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Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

reuters.com

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Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#101

Post by orwin »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #93
bryanlarsen wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The VW group sells 13 different vehicles built on the MEB platform. The id.4 alone sells comparably to the Tesla Y, but if you consider all 13 the same car they are far and away the best selling car in Europe. Considering all 13 the same might be a stretch, but if you just take the 6 that are the same size as the id.4 you still end up with the same result.

In 10-20-30 years, which one do you think you'll be able to maintain - obscure VW ID.4.324.7-cz or Tesla Model Y?

I have hosted the models (mostly regression and random forest) WV use to predict missing part availability at their dealership in 2018-2020 (considering sales in the area, average fabrication/delivery time, likeliness of the part having to be replaced, probably others).

I guarantee you that even if I don't like their car, their dealership will very likely have the part you need around the time you need it. It's not the only car-adjacent company that does something like this (Valeo for sure does it too, i worked with them also), but I'm pretty sure it's the only one who has an internal data scientist team working on it.

Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#102

Post by ajross »

breve wrote: post #100
ajross wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, and I repeat: if this you arguing with drunk uncles, that's not me. If this is you doing praxis and trying to organize, you are aiming at the wrong target by trying to engage with your political allies here on HN. Mostly, I suspect, you're just angry and wanting to blow off steam. Which is fine! But not likely to make either of us feel better.

I don't see the point in the mental gymnastics to make excuses for Musk. He's plainly not as you wish him to be. It's much better to simply see him as he is. This is how he is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smQNNo2a9xc It's not great.

Where do you see me making excuses for Musk? I'm saying I'm happy to drive, buy and recommend a Tesla even if the company is run by a drunk uncle because the other 100,000 of them seem like they worked hard to make a good product. You really think Telsa is the only company with drunk uncles at the helm?

Again, the collision of your personal politics with what you want to achieve seems really muddled here. What do you achieve by yelling at me on HN, exactly?

Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#103

Post by breve »

ajross wrote: post #102
breve wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see the point in the mental gymnastics to make excuses for Musk. He's plainly not as you wish him to be. It's much better to simply see him as he is. This is how he is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smQNNo2a9xc It's not great.

Where do you see me making excuses for Musk? I'm saying I'm happy to drive, buy and recommend a Tesla even if the company is run by a drunk uncle because the other 100,000 of them seem like they worked hard to make a good product. You really think Telsa is the only company with drunk uncles at the helm? Again, the collision of your personal politics with what you want to achieve seems really muddled here. What do you…

Calling him a drunk uncle is making excuses for him.

Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#104

Post by ajross »

breve wrote: post #103
ajross wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where do you see me making excuses for Musk? I'm saying I'm happy to drive, buy and recommend a Tesla even if the company is run by a drunk uncle because the other 100,000 of them seem like they worked hard to make a good product. You really think Telsa is the only company with drunk uncles at the helm? Again, the collision of your personal politics with what you want to achieve seems really muddled here. What do you…

Calling him a drunk uncle is making excuses for him.

Only if you take as a prior that he's somehow more objectionable than the like 20% of the electorate that I'm painting as "drunk uncles". And he's... not. He's just rich. Musk doesn't say or do anything you can't see on Fox every day. He doesn't spout opinions you can't read expressed right here on HN in every politics thread (in fact he's a pretty pure distillation of the HN self-righteous libertarian jerk, honestly).

And you don't like that. And I don't like that either. But I'm not going to judge him any more severely than I do anyone here. And yeah, I think the cars are pretty great, and the people that make them (to first approximation, none of them are Musk!) deserve to have jobs making successful cars.

At the end of the day you need to share society with people you hate. And some of them make products you need or want. This isn't a winnable fight you're engaging in.

Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#105

Post by Night_Thastus »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #89
Night_Thastus wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aside from politics, their cars have a reputation for poor quality control. Peeling steering wheels, leaking seals, funky air conditioner smells, etc. Then when there are problems you may be waiting months while it sits in a service center. Or the stupid thing may shut off (due to errors or updates) right when you need it. I would not want to buy one of them for any of those reasons, regardless.

And their nearest competition Hyundai/Kia have disintegrating reduction gear and exploding inverters. All cars have issues, but stats favour Tesla all while they are cheapest to repair.

Right now the electric car market sucks in the US. I'd honestly recommend people just go hybrid instead. Toyota has been doing it for 18 years now and hasn't had any reliability issues.

Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#106

Post by senordevnyc »

fundatus wrote: post #70
chollida1 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Interesting, not only is Tesla 50% down YTD, TSLA is not down 50% YTD. Its up this year so far. Can you show the math that shows it down 50% YTD?

I am talking about the numbers in the article (Tesla sales in Germany), not the stock: > The number of Teslas sold in the January-October period dropped 50.4% to 15,595 units, compared with the same period last year.

TSLA believers have long since forgotten that these four characters are connected to a company that is ostensibly supposed to be selling cars. It might as well be an NFT to them.

Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#107

Post by mvdtnz »

m463 wrote: post #98
KaiserPro wrote: post #23

Part of this is down to musk being an obnoxious prick, but a larger part is down to teslas not actually being innovative, cheap or high quality enough any more. They look dated, or weird, have patchy customer service, and are not even that long range anymore.

I think the model s, model 3 or the previous model y look great. The recent model y looks terrible, like a duck. And the ergonomics are cheap and dangerous. Removing turn signal stalks, drive select stalks is dangerous. I like the idea of buttons, but turn signal buttons? buttons on a moving steering wheel? and the rest of the critical controls buried on a touchscreen? inside door handles? ugh.

> I think the model s, model 3 or the previous model y look great.

They look terrible. They looked terrible when they came out 13, 8 and 5 years ago and they have aged very poorly.

Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#108

Post by dzhiurgis »

orwin wrote: post #101
dzhiurgis wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 10-20-30 years, which one do you think you'll be able to maintain - obscure VW ID.4.324.7-cz or Tesla Model Y?

I have hosted the models (mostly regression and random forest) WV use to predict missing part availability at their dealership in 2018-2020 (considering sales in the area, average fabrication/delivery time, likeliness of the part having to be replaced, probably others). I guarantee you that even if I don't like their car, their dealership will very likely have the part you need around the time you need it. It's not t…

[flagged]

Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#109

Post by dzhiurgis »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #97
dzhiurgis wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 10-20-30 years, which one do you think you'll be able to maintain - obscure VW ID.4.324.7-cz or Tesla Model Y?

The VW, obviously. With most parts shared across 13 models and all models static for at least a year and usually longer. Plus VW has a good history of parts availability. Tesla on the other hand is famous for both making minor changes to their vehicles pretty much continuously and a bad history of parts availability.

1M cars over 13 models mean you’ll have no parts at all. 10M identical cars means there’s massive third party supply. Parts are already cheaper than Toyota’s.

Re: Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

#110

Post by dzhiurgis »

Night_Thastus wrote: post #105
dzhiurgis wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And their nearest competition Hyundai/Kia have disintegrating reduction gear and exploding inverters. All cars have issues, but stats favour Tesla all while they are cheapest to repair.

Right now the electric car market sucks in the US. I'd honestly recommend people just go hybrid instead. Toyota has been doing it for 18 years now and hasn't had any reliability issues.

But then you’d drive a car made for an 80 year old.
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