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US falls out of 10 most powerful passports list for first time in 20 yrs

theguardian.com

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Re: US falls out of 10 most powerful passports list for first time in 20 yrs

#101

Post by CaptainOfCoit »

int_19h wrote: post #95
CaptainOfCoit wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The vast majority of people in the US still see their future in the US. I mean, obviously, otherwise they wouldn't be there in the first place. Just an anecdote, also with bias, but almost every American I've met outside of the US (from all walks of life, from uber rich to almost homeless) seems to agree with the idea that the US is approaching a "no turning back" point, and cites that as being the reason they move…

It was true for Rome though, at least within the area over which Rome was the hegemon. It took literally centuries to recover back to the level from which Rome collapsed.

Maybe we understand "the world" differently, but the fall of Rome didn't mean the fall of the world, even if you consider "the world" to be Europe.

But if we had a time machine, I'm sure we could find people saying "If Rome becomes a failed state, trust me, the rest of the world will be too." unironically.

Re: US falls out of 10 most powerful passports list for first time in 20 yrs

#102

Post by throw_3 »

keiferski wrote: post #44
BirAdam wrote: post #6

I agree that Dual Citizenship is a dream among a large plurality of Americans, but I don’t think it’s for Visa-free tourism. I think it’s because a growing number of Americans feel that the country is unstable and likely headed toward a failed-state status.

Yeah as an American that has been living abroad for a decade and will be a dual citizen soon: I don’t agree with that take at all. The vast majority of people in the US still see their future in the US. Dual citizenship, much less actually living abroad, is still an extremely niche topic and basically only a thing amongst upper middle class and above professionals and tech workers. And as chaotic and concerning as ma…

[dead]

Re: US falls out of 10 most powerful passports list for first time in 20 yrs

#103

Post by rayiner »

CyberDildonics wrote: post #99
rayiner wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you American?

Why isn't there a straightforward answer? Why is it so convoluted?

If you know about the political situation in America you would know why it is ironic that someone would invoke ancestry-based citizenship rights to leave America out of protest of the current president.

Re: US falls out of 10 most powerful passports list for first time in 20 yrs

#104

Post by CyberDildonics »

rayiner wrote: post #103
CyberDildonics wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why isn't there a straightforward answer? Why is it so convoluted?

If you know about the political situation in America you would know why it is ironic that someone would invoke ancestry-based citizenship rights to leave America out of protest of the current president.

It makes perfect sense to me.

You haven't explained anything, you just keep repeating a vague premise and saying if someone doesn't agree they 'must not understand'.

Re: US falls out of 10 most powerful passports list for first time in 20 yrs

#105

Post by zoklet-enjoyer »

rayiner wrote: post #103
CyberDildonics wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why isn't there a straightforward answer? Why is it so convoluted?

If you know about the political situation in America you would know why it is ironic that someone would invoke ancestry-based citizenship rights to leave America out of protest of the current president.

It's not ironic. It's just the only way out if things get really bad.

Re: US falls out of 10 most powerful passports list for first time in 20 yrs

#106

Post by cmurf »

keiferski wrote: post #96
cmurf wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In his 1st inaugural address, what do you suppose Lincoln meant by the government ceasing? Would people today tolerate tyranny to avoid it?

The American civil war wasn’t a case of a failed state, it was a case of competing states. Very different situation from today. The closest analog to an archetypical failed state in American history is probably the Bleeding Kansas situation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bleeding_Kansas Even then, today’s divisions in America are more urban-rural than geographically separated.

You answered a question I didn’t ask.

Re: US falls out of 10 most powerful passports list for first time in 20 yrs

#107

Post by saguntum »

zoklet-enjoyer wrote: post #86
aaronrobinson wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it’s Italy you may be disappointed as they’ve recently changed the rules

My mom's dad was from Italy and her mom from Germany. I want to try for German citizenship. It looks like I'm eligible based on what I saw online. Previously I had looked into Italian citizenship and found that I wasn't eligible because my grandpa had become an American before my mom was born

Look at reddit.com/r/GermanCitizenship

Re: US falls out of 10 most powerful passports list for first time in 20 yrs

#108

Post by int_19h »

CaptainOfCoit wrote: post #101
int_19h wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was true for Rome though, at least within the area over which Rome was the hegemon. It took literally centuries to recover back to the level from which Rome collapsed.

Maybe we understand "the world" differently, but the fall of Rome didn't mean the fall of the world, even if you consider "the world" to be Europe. But if we had a time machine, I'm sure we could find people saying "If Rome becomes a failed state, trust me, the rest of the world will be too." unironically.

I specifically stated that the domain here is "the area over which Rome was the hegemon". Which is less than the whole world, obviously (but also more than Europe; North Africa, for example). We're talking about the rest of the world today because USA is truly a global hegemon, though.

And I don't know how you define "fall", but the standards of living and things like technological knowledge, culture etc basically cratered for several centuries; it sure does sound like a fall to me. "Failed state" is a modern term that doesn't quite have a direct analogy, but even so what was going on in most Roman provinces (and ultimately even Rome itself) could be reasonably described as such - stable governance would also take centuries to reassert itself.

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