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I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

michael.stapelberg.ch

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Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#101

Post by bob1029 »

microtonal wrote: post #2

I feel like both Intel and AMD are not doing great in the desktop CPU stability department. I made a machine with a Ryzen 9900X a while back and it had the issue that it would freeze when idling. A few years before I had a 5950X that would regularly crash under load (luckily it was a prebuilt, so it was ultimately fixed). When you do not have a bunch of components ready to swap out it is also really hard to debug the…

I've got a 5950x that I can reliably crater with a very specific .NET 8 console app when it would otherwise be stable 24/7/365, even under some pretty crazy workloads like Unity.

I think a lot of it boils down to load profile and power delivery. My 2500VA double conversion UPS seems to have difficulty keeping up with the volatility in load when running that console app. I can tell because its fans ramp up and my lights on the same circuit begin to flicker very perceptibly. It also creates audible PWM noise in the PC which is crazy to me because up til recently I've only ever heard that from a heavily loaded GPU.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#102

Post by williamDafoe »

willtemperley wrote: post #54

Gaming seems to be the final stronghold of x86 and I imagine that will shrink. Clearly games are able to run well on RISC architectures despite decades of x86 optimisation in game engines. Long term, an architecture that consumes more power and is tightly locked down by licensing looks unsustainable compared to royalty-free RISC alternatives. The instability, presumably because Intel are overclocking their own chips…

"Stronghold" is a joke phrase, is it not? Intel had ZERO progress in integrated graphics from 2013-2020. ZERO. That's the reason why "it works so well" - because they NEVER improved the performance or architecture! Sure, they diddled with the number of CU's, but as far as graphics architecture, they never changed it, and it was POOR to begin with (couldn't do 1080p esports very well ...)

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#103

Post by energy123 »

ttyyzz wrote: post #61
energy123 wrote: post #16

I can't comment on the quality question, but for memory bandwidth sensitive use cases, Intel desktop is superior.

I'm not convinced, what would be the use case?

Data science where you need to keep ~50GB of data in RAM and do intensive things with it (e.g. loop over it repeatedly with numba). You can't get use out of more than 4 cores because memory bandwidth is the only limitation. The data is too big for AMD's cache to be a factor.

Threadripper is built for this. But I am talking about the consumer options if you are on a budget. Intel has significantly more memory bandwidth than AMD in the consumer end. I don't have the numbers on hand, but someone at /r/localllama did a comparison a while ago.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#104

Post by williamDafoe »

KronisLV wrote: post #56

> I also double-checked if the CPU temperature of about 100 degrees celsius is too high, but no: this Tom’s Hardware article shows even higher temperatures, and Intel specifies a maximum of 110 degrees. So, running at “only” 100 degrees for a few hours should be fine. I'd say that even crashing at max temperatures is still completely unreasonable! You should be able to run at 100C or whatever the max temperature is f…

Just FYI Google runs their data centers at 85 degrees F (about 30 degrees C). I think Google probably knows more about how to run Intel CPUs for longest life and lowest cost per CPU cycle. After all they are the #5 computer maker on earth. What Intel is doing and what they are recommending is the act of a desperate corporation incapable of designing energy-efficient CPUs, incapable of progressing their performance in MIPS per Watt of power. This is a sign of a failed corporation.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#105

Post by michaelt »

uniqueuid wrote: post #76
Ekaros wrote: post #67

Seems like failure in choosing cooling solutions. These high-end chips have obscene cooling needs. My guess would be using something that was not designed for TDP in question. Sufficient cooler, with sufficient airflow is always needed.

For what it's worth, I have an i9-13900K paired with the largest air cooler available at the time (a be quiet! Dark Rock 5 IIRC), and it's incapable of sufficiently cooling that CPU. The 13900k draws more than 200W initially and thermal throttles after a minute at most, even in an air conditioned room. I don't think that thermal problems should be pushed to end user to this degree.

The "Dark Rock 5" marketing materials say it provides a 210 W TDP [1] and marketers seldom under-sell their products' capabilities.

So if your CPU is drawing "more than 200W" you're pretty much at the limits of your cooler.

[1] https://www.bequiet.com/en/cpucooler/5110

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#106

Post by don-bright »

formerly_proven wrote: post #43

> Looking at my energy meter statistics, I usually ended up at about 9.x kWh per day for a two-person household, cooking with induction. > After switching my PC from Intel to AMD, I end up at 10-11 kWh per day. It's kind of impressive to increase household electricity consumption by 10% by just switching one CPU.

The amount of power this is using is roughly the same as it takes my car to do my short commute to work

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#107

Post by perching_aix »

Havoc wrote: post #95
perching_aix wrote: post #70

[flagged]

It's not some politics thing tom's hardware came up with. It's from the firefox's crash reports: >If you have an Intel Raptor Lake system and you're in the northern hemisphere, chances are that your machine is crashing more often because of the summer heat. I know because I can literally see which EU countries have been affected by heat waves by looking at the locales of Firefox crash reports coming from Raptor Lake…

> That doesn't preclude the possibility of temperature related instability below 100...

Does anything do? It could order a Toyota Corolla to my house when it hits 69 °C 420 times if it was programmed so.

> Nothing that it's different generations - it's not the core ultras (15th) that are known to have these issues

So it is a CPU specific issue then? Not a yuro heatwave issue? Not one he "should have" "mitigated" with a better cooling setup?

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#108

Post by scns »

johnisgood wrote: post #8
microtonal wrote: post #2

I feel like both Intel and AMD are not doing great in the desktop CPU stability department. I made a machine with a Ryzen 9900X a while back and it had the issue that it would freeze when idling. A few years before I had a 5950X that would regularly crash under load (luckily it was a prebuilt, so it was ultimately fixed). When you do not have a bunch of components ready to swap out it is also really hard to debug the…

This does not fill me with much hope. What am I even ought to buy at this point then, I wonder. I have a ~13 years old Intel CPU which lacks AVX2 (and I need it by now) and I thought of buying a new desktop (items separately, of course), but that is crazy to me that it freezes because of the CPU going idle. It was never an issue in my case. I guess I can only hope it is not going to be a problem once I completed buil…

> I thought of AMD Ryzen 7 5700

Definetly not that one if you plan to pair with a dedicated GPU! The 5700X has twice the L3 cache. All Ryzen 5000 with a GPU have only 16MB, 5700 has the GPU deactivated.

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#109

Post by scns »

williamDafoe wrote: post #98
techpression wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 7800X3D is amazing here, runs extremely cool and stable, you can push it far above its defaults and it still won’t get to 80C even with air cooling. Mine was running between 60-70 under load with PBO set to high. Unfortunately it seems its successor is not that great :/

The 7000 series of CPUs is NOT known for running cool, unlike the AMD 5000 series (which are basically server CPUs repurposed for desktop usage). In the 7000 series, AMD decided to just increase the power of each CPU and that's where most of the performance gains are coming from - but power consumption is 40-50% higher than with similar 5000-series CPUs.

When you use EcoMode with them you only lose ~5% performance, but are still ~30% ahead of the corresponding 5000-series CPU. You can reduce PPT/TDP even further while still ahead.

https://www.computerbase.de/artikel/prozessoren/amd-ryzen-79...

Re: I am giving up on Intel and have bought an AMD Ryzen 9950X3D

#110

Post by uncircle »

smallpipe wrote: post #87
willtemperley wrote: post #54

Gaming seems to be the final stronghold of x86 and I imagine that will shrink. Clearly games are able to run well on RISC architectures despite decades of x86 optimisation in game engines. Long term, an architecture that consumes more power and is tightly locked down by licensing looks unsustainable compared to royalty-free RISC alternatives. The instability, presumably because Intel are overclocking their own chips…

x86 hasn't been CISC in 3 decades anywhere but in the frontend. An architecture doesn't consume power, a design does. I'm all for shitting on intel, but getting the facts right wouldn't hurt.

X86 isn’t CISC, sure, but it isn’t a RISC architecture either.
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