Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

washingtonpost.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 117 posts

Re: Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

#101

Post by voidspark »

eesmith wrote: post #100
voidspark wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just using common sense. $4B is less than 1% of their revenue. If they can grow their ad business from $4B to $250B (50% of revenue) then yes maybe I’ll call them an ad company, but I am talking about their reality today, and the reality of Apple for the past 50 years, not fantasy or fiction.

I think you are using gross sales? We can see from Apple's 2024Q4 10-Q that "Revenue" is described as "Net sales", and that Q4 had $8 billion for the IPad, so about $32 billion for the year - comparable to the prediction of "$30 billion ad business by 2026". Total net sales in Q4 was $124 billion of which $26 billion was services (where ads and Google income are placed). The $4 billion was from a few years ago. The a…

Sorry I don’t understand what you are trying to say.

Apple’s 2024 revenue was $391 Billion. Advertising is therefore about 1% of their revenue. Simple mathematics.

"Total net sales" is $391 Billion. $295 Billion from products plus $96 Billion from services.

https://www.apple.com/newsroom/pdfs/fy2024-q4/FY24_Q4_Consol...

Don't confuse quarterly with annual revenue.

Quarterly is just for three months. Four quarters within a year. Apple's fiscal (financial) year ends in September.

Re: Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

#102

Post by betimsl »

lelandbatey wrote: post #36
betimsl wrote: post #32

Apple’s encryption, is designed with end-to-end encryption for many types of data. Some facts: Only the user's devices hold the keys to decrypt the data. Apple cannot decrypt it, even if served a subpoena. Apple chose privacy over convenience. Sue all you want, you're going to lose.

Read the article, that's not true by default, the only way you get that level of cryptographic protection is if you enable "Advanced Data Protection". None of the people in the article did that, all of them can trivially prove they are who they say they are via government documents, Apple could decrypt their data and return it, but Apple is refusing to do so.

It's simply not Apple's responsibility. Person's data, their responsibility. Any other way and people lose trust in Apple which BTW they protect it by any means. Trust.

Instead of wanting something impossible, accept the reality.

Re: Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

#104

Post by eesmith »

voidspark wrote: post #101
eesmith wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are using gross sales? We can see from Apple's 2024Q4 10-Q that "Revenue" is described as "Net sales", and that Q4 had $8 billion for the IPad, so about $32 billion for the year - comparable to the prediction of "$30 billion ad business by 2026". Total net sales in Q4 was $124 billion of which $26 billion was services (where ads and Google income are placed). The $4 billion was from a few years ago. The a…

Sorry I don’t understand what you are trying to say. Apple’s 2024 revenue was $391 Billion. Advertising is therefore about 1% of their revenue. Simple mathematics. "Total net sales" is $391 Billion. $295 Billion from products plus $96 Billion from services. https://www.apple.com/newsroom/pdfs/fy2024-q4/FY24_Q4_Consol... Don't confuse quarterly with annual revenue. Quarterly is just for three months. Four quarters wit…

What number are you using for advertising revenue?

If "Investment bank Evercore ISI estimates Apple will have a $30 billion ad business by 2026" is correct, then $30 billion/$391 Billion is over 7%.

If we go by the 2022 publication number (so likely from 2021) of $4 billion then yes, that's about 1%.

I can't find concrete numbers. https://www.emarketer.com/chart/260183/apple-ad-revenues-wor... has 10 billion in ad revenue for 2024, which would put it at 3% last year.

https://www.investors.com/news/technology/apple-stock-advert... says "he sees Apple's global ad revenue hitting $19 billion by 2026" which would be 5%.

Re: Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

#105

Post by voidspark »

eesmith wrote: post #104
voidspark wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry I don’t understand what you are trying to say. Apple’s 2024 revenue was $391 Billion. Advertising is therefore about 1% of their revenue. Simple mathematics. "Total net sales" is $391 Billion. $295 Billion from products plus $96 Billion from services. https://www.apple.com/newsroom/pdfs/fy2024-q4/FY24_Q4_Consol... Don't confuse quarterly with annual revenue. Quarterly is just for three months. Four quarters wit…

What number are you using for advertising revenue? If "Investment bank Evercore ISI estimates Apple will have a $30 billion ad business by 2026" is correct, then $30 billion/$391 Billion is over 7%. If we go by the 2022 publication number (so likely from 2021) of $4 billion then yes, that's about 1%. I can't find concrete numbers. https://www.emarketer.com/chart/260183/apple-ad-revenues-wor... has 10 billion in ad re…

You said 4 billion

2026 is in the future. Doesn’t exist yet in reality

I don’t really know what point you’re trying to make now

Re: Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

#106

Post by jjav »

nativeit wrote: post #77
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple already can unlock your account "for the gestapo" if they choose to But they don't.

Not sure why this is getting down-voted. There are several high-profile instances of Apple refusing to assist law enforcement in gaining access to devices. I recognize this is cold comfort, and provides only marginal reassurance for the future. That said, for the moment, "But they don't," is a perfectly accurate assessment.

This is unfortunately a pretty naive view of how politics and power works.

Yes there are some high-profile instances of Apple refusing to assist. Since you've heard about those, it is only because there is no gag order on them, which means they are cases the powers that be don't care if you hear about them.

Apple is a US corporation, so for anything the government actually wants to get without publicity, they'll get a rubber stamped NSL which forces both compliance and silence and of course Apple will quietly comply.

This is why the argument of "I trust XYZ company to do right" is illogical. It doesn't matter, because they will be forced to comply. The only way to keep your data safe is to never hand it over to these third parties in the first place.

Re: Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

#107

Post by eesmith »

voidspark wrote: post #105
eesmith wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What number are you using for advertising revenue? If "Investment bank Evercore ISI estimates Apple will have a $30 billion ad business by 2026" is correct, then $30 billion/$391 Billion is over 7%. If we go by the 2022 publication number (so likely from 2021) of $4 billion then yes, that's about 1%. I can't find concrete numbers. https://www.emarketer.com/chart/260183/apple-ad-revenues-wor... has 10 billion in ad re…

You said 4 billion 2026 is in the future. Doesn’t exist yet in reality I don’t really know what point you’re trying to make now

$4 billion in an Oct 20, 2022 article, with evidence that it's increased noticeably since then (because the 10-Q says so).

I don't think dividing the pre-Oct 2022 ad income by the 2024 revenue is all that meaningful.

Re: Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

#108

Post by JCattheATM »

voidspark wrote: post #65
ddtaylor wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You pay to rent the phone I'm pretty sure.

I don't know what you are talking about. You can buy an iPhone. They sell 200 million iPhones every year. Just go to the shop and buy one.

If you own it, you can put whatever apps you want on it, right?

Re: Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

#109

Post by yencabulator »

nativeit wrote: post #77
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple already can unlock your account "for the gestapo" if they choose to But they don't.

Not sure why this is getting down-voted. There are several high-profile instances of Apple refusing to assist law enforcement in gaining access to devices. I recognize this is cold comfort, and provides only marginal reassurance for the future. That said, for the moment, "But they don't," is a perfectly accurate assessment.

You do not know, and would not know, if Apple has complied with an NSL or not.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_security_letter

Re: Thieves took their iPhones. Apple won't give their digital lives back

#110

Post by voidspark »

eesmith wrote: post #107
voidspark wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You said 4 billion 2026 is in the future. Doesn’t exist yet in reality I don’t really know what point you’re trying to make now

$4 billion in an Oct 20, 2022 article, with evidence that it's increased noticeably since then (because the 10-Q says so). I don't think dividing the pre-Oct 2022 ad income by the 2024 revenue is all that meaningful.

So what? Then it's at 2% now?

It's an insignificant part of their business even if it doubled or tripled in size.

Apple is obviously not "an advertising company" as opposed to Google which has been an advertising company since the beginning.

Apple was founded as a computer company ~50 years ago which sold the Apple I. Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak. Nothing to do with ads. Now 50 years later they are starting to make some extra money on the side from ad revenue.

Post reply on HN