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A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

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Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#101

Post by floren »

IgorPartola wrote: post #75

I recently rediscovered Ratpoison WM and the origin of its name (tl;dr it is meant to prevent the need for using a mouse). I think the main issue for me really is that navigating the web is sometimes faster with a pointer. I already use vim and the shell for everything else, but navigating Google Maps or Wikipedia or Stack Overflow is just easier when you can point and scroll.

Use the right tool for the job and don't feel bad about it. A pointing device is an excellent way to point at things.

Btw I've been using stumpwm for years, it's ratpoison but implemented in Common Lisp. Give it a look!

Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#102

Post by dizhn »

eimrine wrote: post #98
dizhn wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Set up your own shortcuts for the software that matters to you. Terminal emulator and text editor/IDE will pay for the effort spent very quickly.

That "pay" will always disappears, but the keyboard placement and vim commands never disappear.

I think we're having a disconnect here. You can keep your custom settings and take them with you wherever you go. This actually also applies to your operating system (especially Linux) but I personally do not mess with them much unless it's a tiling window manager - which is another class of software that benefits greatly from setting up custom shortcuts.

Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#103

Post by cess11 »

IgorPartola wrote: post #93
cess11 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you tried Vimium or something similar?

I have not. Worth a try?

I think it's a nice first step in running web browsers from the keyboard. Well, beyond built-in functionality.

You push 'f' to get link hints, if there's few they'll be things like 'a', 'c', 'j', 'l', if many it'll build up algorithmically, most I've seen is triples, like 'ade'. You push those keys and it opens the linked page. 'H' to go backwards, 'd' and 'u' to scroll down and up, 'yf' and then a link hint to copy a link URL, 'x' to close a page and 'X' to open the last closed, and so on.

Some people want more, like vim motions in input fields and so on, so they opt for more complex tools.

Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#104

Post by joseda-hg »

eimrine wrote: post #55
PeeMcGee wrote: post #35

It's really humbling and everyone should do it every now and then. An old coworker coined "mouseless monday mornings" where we'd unplug our mice(?) until lunch to start each week. We all learned a lot about how to be more efficient in our IDE's, learned tons of useful OS and browser shortcuts, observed tons of accessibility flaws in our product, and all of that during the dullest hours of the week.

One is so stupid, to learn some "useful shorcuts" which are existing only until some megacorp is going to change anything in their software (OS, IDE, browser has almost none of them). I am a huge proponent of learning touchtyping, then vim and... nothing more.

I find I can do plenty in the browser via Vimium extension, tabbing and general keyboard shortcuts (PgUp/Dn, Ctrl+t/n/f/e/r/q)

Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#105

Post by perdomon »

addaon wrote: post #31
perdomon wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The worst for me is being able to select the non-default option in an alert window. Sometimes CMD + 'the first letter of the word in the button' works, but that's like a 30% chance. How is there not a standard for that? I'd even accept the arrow keys + Enter at this point.

If the non-default option is a cancellation or negative action, cmd-period should usually work.

This is a great tip that I didn't know about. Thank you. It doesn't work for Numbers, since I need to DELETE not Cancel the file changes, but I'm sure it'll work in a ton of other places.

Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#106

Post by perdomon »

egypturnash wrote: post #60
perdomon wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The worst for me is being able to select the non-default option in an alert window. Sometimes CMD + 'the first letter of the word in the button' works, but that's like a 30% chance. How is there not a standard for that? I'd even accept the arrow keys + Enter at this point.

Often space cycles this, for some reason.

This is a nice tip! This does not work for MacOS alerts that want you to enter data (like a file name to save), but I will be using this and the other guy's CMD + . (period) tip as much as possible in every other scenario.

Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#107

Post by addaon »

perdomon wrote: post #105
addaon wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the non-default option is a cancellation or negative action, cmd-period should usually work.

This is a great tip that I didn't know about. Thank you. It doesn't work for Numbers, since I need to DELETE not Cancel the file changes, but I'm sure it'll work in a ton of other places.

Delete button in dialog: cmd-delete.

(Edit: Just tested this in numbers, works fine. In cases where the button isn't correctly tagged as a "delete" button it might not -- in that case, cmd- will almost always work.)

Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#108

Post by perdomon »

addaon wrote: post #107
perdomon wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a great tip that I didn't know about. Thank you. It doesn't work for Numbers, since I need to DELETE not Cancel the file changes, but I'm sure it'll work in a ton of other places.

Delete button in dialog: cmd-delete. (Edit: Just tested this in numbers, works fine. In cases where the button isn't correctly tagged as a "delete" button it might not -- in that case, cmd- will almost always work.)

Absolute legend

Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#109

Post by perdomon »

addaon wrote: post #107
perdomon wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a great tip that I didn't know about. Thank you. It doesn't work for Numbers, since I need to DELETE not Cancel the file changes, but I'm sure it'll work in a ton of other places.

Delete button in dialog: cmd-delete. (Edit: Just tested this in numbers, works fine. In cases where the button isn't correctly tagged as a "delete" button it might not -- in that case, cmd- will almost always work.)

Okay, one more question. When I have multiple terminal tabs open with processes running, I get an alert window with three options: Review Windows, Terminate Processes, Cancel:

https://imgur.com/a/mNQNRaI

I can cancel with CMD + (period), but I can't seem to select Terminate Processes with anything except the mouse, since it isn't the default option and it isn't cancel.

Any idea if this one is possible without turning on the keyboard navigation accessibility option?

Re: A mouseless tale: trying for a keyboard-driven desktop

#110

Post by addaon »

perdomon wrote: post #109
addaon wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Delete button in dialog: cmd-delete. (Edit: Just tested this in numbers, works fine. In cases where the button isn't correctly tagged as a "delete" button it might not -- in that case, cmd- will almost always work.)

Okay, one more question. When I have multiple terminal tabs open with processes running, I get an alert window with three options: Review Windows, Terminate Processes, Cancel: https://imgur.com/a/mNQNRaI I can cancel with CMD + (period), but I can't seem to select Terminate Processes with anything except the mouse, since it isn't the default option and it isn't cancel. Any idea if this one is possible without turning…

It /should/ be cmd-t, but just confirmed that that doesn't work. I'd consider this a bug, and would suggest filing a radar for it.
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