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Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

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Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#101

Post by wesselbindt »

andrewla wrote: post #92

Without digging too deep into the nature of the statistics they use, I'm a little skeptical of this. The transition to using the word "homeless" has resulted in transforming something we can't easily measure -- "drug addicted or mentally ill people being a public menace" -- into something that we can measure -- "people without a good living arrangement". Sure, the latter is important in a lot of ways too. And there h…

Have you ever considered that it may be the other way around? That the horrors of living on the street (and "horrors" is an appropriate term here, you are fighting for survival every day; it is beyond the realm of comprehension of the housed) might be causing the mental illness and drug use, rather than the other way around?

If I want to get a homeless person off of drugs, it sure as crisps is not going to happen until they have a roof over their head. The core issue is the lack of affordable housing. That should be priority number 1.

Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#102

Post by [deleted] »

peab wrote: post #86
nostromo wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how every westerner visits Japan and comes home thinking we can "solve crime" or "solve homelessness" or "have clean subway stations." Japan's culture is why those things are the way they are. It's not due to funding. It's because people raise their children differently than we do in the west. The family's obligations are also greater. And, yes, there are homeless people in Japan. But they typically are in…

Even if it's cultural, it can be fixed. Culture can change and can be changed by choice

[deleted]

Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#103

Post by beedeebeedee »

IncreasePosts wrote: post #94
thePhytochemist wrote: post #50

This issue is very relevant for me since I have been homeless since May. It's been a bad run of being a target of criminal activity, unemployment and just running out of money during my job search. I cope with a mix of volunteering, overpriced housing (think $1200/month for a room in a rural area before I ran out of money for that), catsitting, house-sitting, staying with family and sleeping in my ancient car. Althou…

With all due respect, why volunteer? I notice this with a lot of homeless people I chat with (there's a lot here in Boulder) - many of them volunteer their time at various charities while being homeless. Wouldn't it be better devoting 100% of your spare time to getting back on your feet, and then volunteer, or donate?

Volunteer work can come with benefits other than payment, such as food, access to facilities, etc. It can also provide a support network and contacts for finding work.

With that knowledge (despite not knowing specific circumstances), it sounds like a highly effective way to cope with the situation as an individual.

Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#104

Post by thfuran »

peab wrote: post #86
nostromo wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how every westerner visits Japan and comes home thinking we can "solve crime" or "solve homelessness" or "have clean subway stations." Japan's culture is why those things are the way they are. It's not due to funding. It's because people raise their children differently than we do in the west. The family's obligations are also greater. And, yes, there are homeless people in Japan. But they typically are in…

Even if it's cultural, it can be fixed. Culture can change and can be changed by choice

Culture changes, but it's very hard to deliberately effect specific changes.

Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#105

Post by m2024 »

andrewla wrote: post #92

Without digging too deep into the nature of the statistics they use, I'm a little skeptical of this. The transition to using the word "homeless" has resulted in transforming something we can't easily measure -- "drug addicted or mentally ill people being a public menace" -- into something that we can measure -- "people without a good living arrangement". Sure, the latter is important in a lot of ways too. And there h…

A lot of words to say that doing anything at all must be impossible.

Not understanding how homelessness (or poverty generally) leads to mental illness is remarkably disconnected.

Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#106

Post by cousin_it »

I think governments should offer free housing to everyone who asks, in their city of choice. "But why should taxpayers pay for that? It's expensive!" Yes, it would be very expensive. But you know what's even more expensive? The sum of everybody's lowered wages, bad bosses, fear for the future, fear of having kids and so on, due to the threat of homelessness. Yes, building housing is expensive, but the removal of fear will pay for it many times over.

Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#107

Post by [deleted] »

segasaturn wrote: post #91
stevenicr wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My first read of this document leads me to believe that there are only about 341,000 housing units available for rent, there are some for sale at an average price of $373,000.. but many or most of the empty housing units are like second homes and such and not 'available'. So we have 350k open units and 700k people without homes, average rent is around $1500.. just looking at the data my guess is that we have about 70…

Those houses sitting empty with no-one in them is exactly why the price of rent is so high. The supply is there but it's being hoarded by 1% of the population. Write laws that would force people to rent out their secondary houses, condos and apartments (with the threat of having it seized if they don't) and watch the prices immediately start to fall.

[deleted]

Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#108

Post by wesselbindt »

nostromo wrote: post #63
octopusRex wrote: post #8

The US chooses not to end homelessness. We have the highest GDP in the world. We could end it if we wanted to. I was in Japan recently. A choice was made there as well.

It's funny how every westerner visits Japan and comes home thinking we can "solve crime" or "solve homelessness" or "have clean subway stations." Japan's culture is why those things are the way they are. It's not due to funding. It's because people raise their children differently than we do in the west. The family's obligations are also greater. And, yes, there are homeless people in Japan. But they typically are in…

[flagged]

Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#109

Post by Aunche »

andrewla wrote: post #92

Without digging too deep into the nature of the statistics they use, I'm a little skeptical of this. The transition to using the word "homeless" has resulted in transforming something we can't easily measure -- "drug addicted or mentally ill people being a public menace" -- into something that we can measure -- "people without a good living arrangement". Sure, the latter is important in a lot of ways too. And there h…

> "drug addicted or mentally ill people being a public menace"

Finland also is rather aggressive with involuntary detention of those deemed to be a potential danger to themselves or others.

Re: Finland's zero homeless strategy (2021)

#110

Post by skirge »

cousin_it wrote: post #106

I think governments should offer free housing to everyone who asks, in their city of choice. "But why should taxpayers pay for that? It's expensive!" Yes, it would be very expensive. But you know what's even more expensive? The sum of everybody's lowered wages, bad bosses, fear for the future, fear of having kids and so on, due to the threat of homelessness. Yes, building housing is expensive, but the removal of fear…

Everyone wants to live in the centre of Helsinki, because why not?
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