Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately • Hacker News Board

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#101

Post by crazygringo » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 1:30 PM UTC

tpoacher wrote: post #90

A prof of mine back in Oxford told us a story how he invented a similar noninvasive blood glucose monitoring technique, shown to work, patented it, patent bought by big pharma and silenced. I'm more than convinced we had this tech ages ago but it was not profitable to deploy it. Now either relevant patents are finally expiring or the market has changed enough to allow such players to enter.

Do you have a link to his patent? You should be able to find it by his name.

But the hurdle today isn't in the physical sensing technology, it's how to detect an accurate signal from extremely noisy data.

Patents aren't the main blocker -- nobody has built this at all in a way that is accurate enough. And Apple has been trying hard, and they have nothing to do with Big Pharma.

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#102

Post by manmal » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 1:30 PM UTC

rorytbyrne wrote: post #92

solumunus wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh there will be a subscription, don’t worry about that.

But if they want to capture (or create, commercially) the market they’ll probably price it closer to $20 or under.

More likely is a dollar per day for T2 and higher for T1. The differentiator will be non-invasiveness, not price.

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#103

Post by manmal » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 1:37 PM UTC

DavideNL wrote: post #67

Trasmatta wrote: post #2

> Currently, diabetics must frequently prick their fingers or rely on invasive wearable patches with micro-needles to track their blood-sugar levels Type 1 diabetic here - for what it's worth, CGMs aren't particularly invasive. At least in comparison to the many many years of finger pricking! But a smart watch solution would be cool. (I actually do get my CGM readings on my smart watch, which is really nice!) I know…

> but for me, the biggest quality of life improvements for me will be continued improvements with closed loop CGM + insulin pump systems You might find this interesting: "A bi-hormonal fully closed loop system" https://www.inredadiabetic.nl/en/home-english/

Having talked with T1 diabetics about such systems, the issue is that you don’t want to deplete glycogen stores just for basal management. Because your life might depend on their levels in case of a severe hypo.

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#104

Post by lolc » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 2:29 PM UTC

tpoacher wrote: post #90

A prof of mine back in Oxford told us a story how he invented a similar noninvasive blood glucose monitoring technique, shown to work, patented it, patent bought by big pharma and silenced. I'm more than convinced we had this tech ages ago but it was not profitable to deploy it. Now either relevant patents are finally expiring or the market has changed enough to allow such players to enter.

I'm sceptical of this story. This is a huge market and it was a huge market 20 years ago.

I participated in studies with prototype devices to measure blood glucose and nobody I talked to mentioned patent blocks.

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#105

Post by brookst » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 3:00 PM UTC

manmal wrote: post #102

rorytbyrne wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if they want to capture (or create, commercially) the market they’ll probably price it closer to $20 or under.

More likely is a dollar per day for T2 and higher for T1. The differentiator will be non-invasiveness, not price.

Then they will get their lunch eaten when smartwatch / ring / etc companies ship it for free. Probably smarter to go for market share with affordable one-time costs and build revenue from conplementsry goods and services.

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#106

Post by sheepscreek » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 3:05 PM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #29

sheepscreek wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they didn't do any testing, at all, with actual humans (or animals) They did mention in the article that clinical trials are on-going.

Correct, but I'm extremely skeptical, and that sentence had my bullshit detector alarms screaming even louder: > “We have a minimum viable product that’s already being used in clinical trials, and while there’s more work to be done, we’re much closer to a full marketable device,” Shaker said. Absolutely no information about what this "clinical trial" entails, or what phase it was. Most importantly, to get an initial…

It’s fair to be skeptical. Personally, I’ll believe it when I see it in action. There’s likely an unexplained catch or they wouldn’t have shared any hard data in the paper.

One possibility is that they want to sell this technology to a big company without publicly disclosing all their trade secrets. However, this research could have been sponsored by a public grant, which would have compelled them to share some information. Therefore, they published a paper that appears more like a patent application than a research paper with solid data. It’s still noteworthy that it was published in Nature.

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#107

Post by morganherlocker » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 3:13 PM UTC

mmooss wrote: post #45

jimrandomh wrote: post #27

This is yet another in a long line of glucose-measurement devices designed to sell to unsophisticated research grantmaking agencies, rather than to diabetics. Making a device that "measures" blood sugar in a watch form factor is easy, and many research groups have done so. Making one that's accurate enough to compete with the CGMs that are already on the market is a different matter entirely.

What about this research indicates to you that it doesn't address the accuracy issue?

> Shaker said. “No other technology can provide this level of precision without direct contact with the bloodstream.”

The existing alternatives do have access to the bloodstream.

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#108

Post by barbegal » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 3:19 PM UTC

There's far too many variables in skin for any non invasive techniques to work reliably in measuring blood glucose levels. The patches work fine and are highly accurate. The real next innovation is implanting devices inside the skin but the miniaturisation of the energy source to do this isn't quite there yet.

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#109

Post by algorithmsRcool » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 3:25 PM UTC

I'm happy at the prospect of more accurate readings. But honestly, the Libre 3 is already simply excellent and I would personally prefer the back of the arm location to more wrist based tech. I wear a traditional (Citizen) mechanical watch, because I hated needing to charge a smartwatch.

I had some issues with the Libre 2 sensor getting knocked off or loosening after a few days in the shower. But the libre 3 is smaller than a US quarter coin and lasts 15 days and doesn't snag on anything. Will this watch exceed that? Because if not, then I'm not looking to switch.

Lastly for diabetics or pre-diabetics that are only using finger sticks, I CANNOT stress enough how important a CGM is to your health. You learn so much about how your body actually works with certian foods rather than low frequency (but somewhat more accurate) finger sticks and that information dropped my A1C like a rock in just a few months. Tell your older relatives also. These are life saving devices.

Re: Researchers design wearable tech that can sense glucose levels more accurately

#110

Post by lukan » Sun, Jan 05, 2025, 3:28 PM UTC

mzhaase wrote: post #87

lukan wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would I as a nondiabetic buy it? Out of general curiosity for my blood sugar levels?

Would be a real game changer for endurance sports. There is "bonking" - depletion of muscle glycogen. When that happens your race is over. Sometimes it happens even to high level athletes what feels like out of the blue. If you knew ahead of time your blood sugar is getting low you could prevent it.

"If you knew ahead of time your blood sugar is getting low you could prevent it."

If I am connected to my body, I can also feel it by own biological sensors. But I do see the use case, to get another data input, for those cases where I am distracted and don't pay too much attention on myself.