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Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

bitsaboutmoney.com

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Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#101
post #46

We blame car manufacturers for defects from suppliers, but we don't blame platform manufacturers (Microsoft) for holes in their architecture?

You don't blame your car's manufacturer if it won't start because the monitoring dongle your insurance provider sent you in exchange for a discount drained the car's battery.

Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#102
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Should endpoint protection require kernel level access? At what point does it stop becoming protection and start becoming a liability? Obligatory who watches/protects the watchmen/protector...

How else would you monitor a windows box? EU won't allow Microsoft to lock down their kernel and provide MacOS type solution with APIs for trust publishers.

From what I have heard, Microsoft is allowed to do that, they merely aren't allowed to be a competitor to the software that uses the API.

Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#103
post #3

I'm still amazed how the blame shifted from Microsoft to CrowdStrike. Yes, CrowdStrike update caused that -- but applications fail all the time. It was Microsoft's oversight to put it on Windows critical path. And banks/airlines etc were hit hard because their _Windows_ didn't boot, not because of an application crash on a perfectly working Windows.

I’ve used this analogy before.

If I sell you a bike and you remove the breaks you can’t sue me when you crash.

Any OS which allows users to do what they generally want to do, also allows users to fubar their own systems.

Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#104
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Management decides to use Crowdstrike, not IT, and IT has no way to rollout updates in controlled fashion. So not really a failure of IT, at least not for this reason.

My comment assumes that the IT department (including its executive) gets to make these sort decisions - why wouldn't they?

Major purchases tend to be pushed up the ladder. It’s not uncommon for a CEO or non technical director etc to decide what IT systems to use.

Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#105
post #90

I like the technical stuff here. I'm not so sure about this: > money is core societal infrastructure, like the power grid and transportation systems are. It would be really bad if hackers working for a foreign government could just turn off money. Sure, it would be inconvenient in the short term. But I think the current design is holding us back. I suspect that most of us would have more to gain than to lose if we ma…

In the short term people would probably starve to death.

Probably not. A competent government could install temporary rationing for the most essential goods such as food. It happened through the the whole of the 1917—1920 Russian revolution, with four or five kinds of paper money being circulated around, and the urban population managed through it only if barely. That government was much less competent than the US government is today.

Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#106

The takeaway from this article seems to be: buy crowdstrike shares, because major corps are unable to make any changes, and will continue to pay licensing fees for this "service" for the foreseeable future.

The lawsuits alone are going to be eyewatering. But sure, buy those shares.

Just spitballing, but I think the lawsuits will take years to come to any conclusion, and in the mean time Crowdstrike will continue to be paid and make a profit. And the conclusion is not really predictable.

Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#107
post #58

Maybe the IT departments at the affected orgs take solace in the fact that so many other orgs had issues that the heat is off - but in my opinion this was still a failure of IT itself. There's no reason that update should have been pushed automatically to the entire fleet. If Crowdstrike's software doesn't give you a way to rollout updates on a portion of your network before the entire fleet, it shouldn't be used.

The update bypassed the controls orgs had in place to defer/schedule updates, AFAIK.

Generally none gates content updates as they happen multiple times a day

Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically, this is exactly the failure pattern that the changes in Chrome extensions to manifest v3 try to prevent. You can't provide a guarantee to the end-user of pre-vetted safety when the application is downloading and executing arbitrary code from a third-party source. That's like expecting a static code verifier to prevent all runtime errors. It is, perhaps, a guarantee that no vendor should be expected to mak…

> You can't provide a guarantee to the end-user of pre-vetted safety when the application is downloading and executing arbitrary code from a third-party source. So a web browser can't be trusted or certified, ever. Unless JavaScript is disabled?

JS lives in a sandbox, that will require a bug to escape. Plugins are out of sandbox and random plugins should be disabled if security is a concern.

Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#109
post #67
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Couldn't you just ask some OS APIs provided by something in kernelspace for what you need? In fact, isn't this how macOS does things?

You could, and in fact this is what Microsoft wanted to do. The EU said that they couldn't. And the reason why not is simple. Anything that Microsoft thinks is a good thing to add to the API, they'll add for themselves. When the new API is released, their software is released with it. This gives them a competitive advantage over competitors who have to wait for Microsoft to have the idea that they want, and then scra…

This is why tech conglomerates are anti-competitive and need to be broken up. There is no reason a leading operating system company should be allowed to also be a word processing, video conferencing, and music-selling company. They will leverage their control of the operating system business to gain unearned competitive advantage in the unrelated markets.

Re: Why the CrowdStrike bug hit banks hard

#110
post #3

I'm still amazed how the blame shifted from Microsoft to CrowdStrike. Yes, CrowdStrike update caused that -- but applications fail all the time. It was Microsoft's oversight to put it on Windows critical path. And banks/airlines etc were hit hard because their _Windows_ didn't boot, not because of an application crash on a perfectly working Windows.

Is there any merit to Microsoft's argument that the EU forced them into keeping their kernel accessible by 3rd parties? https://www.theregister.com/2024/07/22/windows_crowdstrike_k...

The EU's rules are that Microsoft can't hoard APIs away from competitors, not that they have to give competitors a kernel driver SDK. If Microsoft says Windows Defender needs a kernel driver, then CrowdStrike gets to ship a kernel driver, too.

Microsoft, interestingly enough, is working on a project to add an eBPF[0] runtime to the NT kernel. If they were to use this for their own security products then I doubt the EU would prohibit them from transitioning third-party security products to eBPF programs. Antitrust and competition law do not care about specific technical measures competitors use to compete, just that dominant companies are not shutting competitors out of markets.

[0] Formerly "extended Berkley Packet Filter", eBPF lets you run safety-verified code in kernel space. Notably, the verifier isn't just a signing check, it can actually ensure the code won't crash the kernel directly.

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