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Tracking Illicit Brazilian Beef from the Amazon to Your Burger

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Re: Tracking Illicit Brazilian Beef from the Amazon to Your Burger

#101

Post by [deleted] »

hpestyghr wrote: post #55
nanna wrote: post #11

A month or so ago a ship filled with 19,000 Brazilian cattle destined for the Middle East docked in Cape Town. The cows were living in such horrendous conditions that the stink of the ship took over the entire city. Living in pools of excrement, sick, lame, pregnant and even dead cows among them. The South African animal protection service had to put many down. It's easy, its right to blame the Bolsonaro regime for h…

In this specific case, it's because Middle Eastern countries want live imports due to halal requirements. Live exports should be entirely banned.

[deleted]

Re: Tracking Illicit Brazilian Beef from the Amazon to Your Burger

#102

Post by tgv »

andsmedeiros wrote: post #38

[flagged]

I'm a vegetarian, and while not vegan, I take care to reduce animal products to a minimum, but IMO ethical meat exists. If a farmer has a few chickens running around, and he slaughters one for consumption, that's fine with me. It would only be unethical if you hold all (animal) life sacred, a very difficult position. It's the scale and means of meat production that makes meat consumption unethical and immoral.

Re: Tracking Illicit Brazilian Beef from the Amazon to Your Burger

#104

Post by mtnGoat »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #10
Qem wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Beef in itself is not bad for the environment. It's the scale of demand that is bad. Wasting crops feeding cattle is inherently worse than the alternative, feeding directly on the crops and avoiding the wasting of calories when going up one trophic level.

That's an uneeded "optimisation". There is nothing wrong with eating meat and breeding cattle. Again, the issue is that the environment has a limited, finite capacity, which we exceed when we are 10 billion with good standards of living. To reduce quality of life (because it's not limited to meat, it's comprehensive restrictions) simply to accomodate ever more humans on the planet is madness and unsustainable, anyway…

And to think those 50-60 million animals were slaughtered and laid to waste just to starve the natives out of the Great Plains.

Re: Tracking Illicit Brazilian Beef from the Amazon to Your Burger

#105

Post by lukas099 »

user90131313 wrote: post #89
block_dagger wrote: post #28

[flagged]

No, there is no better protein

Protein quality only matters if you’re not getting enough protein.

Here’s some good discussion you should read https://www.barbellmedicine.com/blog/barbell-medicine-protei...

Re: Tracking Illicit Brazilian Beef from the Amazon to Your Burger

#107

Post by debacle »

matt_daemon wrote: post #2

For anyone interested in the numbers behind how bad beef and deforestation are for the environment, see Hannah Ritchie’s great new book Not the End of the World .

As a counter point, livestock are a critical part of the regenerative ag movement.

Our property was farmland for 150 years before it basically ran out of nutrients in the 1970s. After one year of a pretty good harvest (not great) in 2019, we couldn't grow anything. One home testing kit later, and we found that there were virtually no minerals in the soil.

Fast forward five years and between heavy composting and generating a very healthy amount of bird waste, we're just starting to restore the nutrient balance in the soil. The next step (in progress) is planting some native grasses and low lying shrubs to try and break up the practically impenetrable clay pan that exists below the soil.

Many people dislike meat eating, and I understand that, but developing a healthy relationship with the land practically requires some form of livestock. We are turning "dead" land into highly productive pasture literally in one growing cycle.

Re: Tracking Illicit Brazilian Beef from the Amazon to Your Burger

#108

Post by carlosjobim »

lukas099 wrote: post #75
carlosjobim wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That should be the last concern of any decent human being. If they outlaw breathing, will you stop? Hunting is something our species has done for over a billion years by this point.

I am pro-hunting. But this isn’t a good argument. 1) equivocating hunting with breathing? One is necessary for life, the other is done by less than a quarter of people, and for most of them it’s just a hobby. 2) slavery has also been done probably since humanity began millions of years ago, so that clearly is not sufficient for something shoulding be legal.

Hunting is just as necessary for life as breathing. Domestication of animals and agriculture are the unnatural ways that man has invented. So banning it is banning the most natural human behaviour. All other predators do nothing except hunt, breathe, drink, sleep and mate. And they don't keep slaves.

There's a lot of people who never drink water, but drinking water is still essential and shouldn't be outlawed.

Re: Tracking Illicit Brazilian Beef from the Amazon to Your Burger

#109

Post by asoneth »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #62
emptysongglass wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is nothing wrong with eating meat and breeding cattle. You're not doing a whole lot to explain why there is nothing wrong with eating meat and breeding cattle. I can think of a whole host of reasons why it is wrong in matters of ethics and mercy. Who is there to advocate for the cow? We know cows feel a gamut of emotions just as we do. They are not insensate. Most humans, when given a knife or a captive bolt…

There is nothing wrong or unethical with eating meat. It is a natural behaviour, which we are evolved for, and in fact a necessary animal behaviour within the environment at large. If you do not wish to eat meat for personal reasons you are free to do so of course but I object to the current trend of minority groups trying to impose their views to the whole of society and to paint those who disagree as 'wrong'.

> I object to the current trend of minority groups trying to impose their views to the whole of society and to paint those who disagree as 'wrong'.

I'm curious what you mean by "impose their views" with respect to meat-eating. Has a vegan ever tried to stop you from eating meat for example through physical force, threatening your livelihood, making meat illegal in their state, etc?

Don't get me wrong, I also dislike when strangers impose their moral, ethical, racial, political, or religious views on me.

But of all the groups that concern me, vegans are low on my list as their weapons mostly seem to be uncomfortably strong arguments on the internet and the occasional preachy Netflix documentary.

Re: Tracking Illicit Brazilian Beef from the Amazon to Your Burger

#110

Post by valicord »

chasd00 wrote: post #40
ljf wrote: post #34

I grew up on a (very) small farm - so I knew where all the meat we ate (and eggs, apple, plums and jam) came from. One of the things I find most disconcerting as an adult is the disconnect with the food I eat. Even the local 'farmer butcher' - I don't actually know if the meat they sell me is what they say it is. I buy a lot of deer from a friend of a friend as it feels slightly more known to me - even if I have no i…

Isn’t selling venison against the law?

I'd be more concerned about prions in this case.
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