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2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

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Re: 2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

#101

Post by cogman10 »

sheepscreek wrote: post #100

It’s a positive thing, tbh. I wish the number was bigger. Our desire to switch to the hottest new thing has a significant environmental impact. People don’t need the fastest available mobile internet for checking mails or streaming videos at 1 Mbps. They don’t need the fastest PCs for using Google docs. We don’t need massive pickup trucks for doing grocery runs or even hauling passengers around. It’s fair for anyone…

I see environmental impact of electronics frequently mentioned but, gotta be honest, I'm not sure I really buy that there is a major environmental impact there. Even if someone is getting a brand new phone every year, that's how much plastic and silicon? In a year?

Compare that to the daily disposable plastics just for food. Or the amount of plastics for shipping and storing goods.

Re: 2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

#102

Post by cogman10 »

crote wrote: post #79
richjdsmith wrote: post #9

Has 4G/5G improved? When I lived in the UK (Midlands until 2019) it was entirely unreliable. I'd wager 75% of my connection was on 3G as soon as I was more than 3Km from a town's high street. I can say with confidence that the shift from 4G/LTE to 5G where I live now in British Columbia (Canada) mountains is not fun. It's significantly less reliable. I understand that its 10x faster, but I'd much prefer reliable over…

Ironically 3G is often the reason 4G/5G has poor reception. 1G/2G/3G all need to have a dedicated channel for itself. They were usually given the frequencies with the longest range, which is the 800MHz band. When 4G was introduced it couldn't share that band with 3G, so it was usually given space on higher frequencies around 1800MHz and 2500MHz. Those bands also allow a higher data rate, and anyone out of their range…

All this is true, but there is a bit of nuance. Long range isn't always desirable for wireless communication. Certainly if you are talking about low population areas then it's king. But when you start talking about heavily populated areas the long range becomes a detriment for the network stability. You can end up with cell towers servicing too many people (streaming youtube) which can ultimately overload a node but also cause a lot of signal disruption.

As population density goes up, the higher frequency bandwidths become much more desirable. This is part of the reason why the WiFi standard has been pushing up into 5ghz and 60ghz frequencies. Because you don't want your wifi signal to be yelled over to the neighbor.

Re: 2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

#103

Post by bArray »

ffgjgf1 wrote: post #77
bArray wrote: post #75

> Furthermore, the study also reveals 21% of those with a 3G handset aren’t willing to upgrade, and will simply continue to use their phone without internet connectivity. My bet would be that these are mostly devices given to children to watch Youtube and what-not. > However, calls and texts will continue to work despite the 3G switch off, as 2G won’t be fully switched off until 2033 the latest. This is because 2G is…

Are there that many smartphones that are actually capable of running YT and have a access to a version of Android/iOS that’s still supported and are 4g only? iPhone 5 was the first to support 4G and I’m not sure the 4s or 4 are really suitable for watching YT these days?

I have a 3G device still able to watch YT and a very old Kindle Fire that has NewPipe [1] installed for watching YT in bed (whilst my phone is on charge).

I don't see why not either - if the device was capable of H264 when it was released, why not now?

[1] https://newpipe.net/

Re: 2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

#104

Post by bArray »

lancebeet wrote: post #80
bArray wrote: post #75

> Furthermore, the study also reveals 21% of those with a 3G handset aren’t willing to upgrade, and will simply continue to use their phone without internet connectivity. My bet would be that these are mostly devices given to children to watch Youtube and what-not. > However, calls and texts will continue to work despite the 3G switch off, as 2G won’t be fully switched off until 2033 the latest. This is because 2G is…

I agree with the general sentiment but 2g was launched in 1991. Turned off "tomorrow" seems like a bit of an exaggeration. 3g has also been available for 2 decades.

> [..] but 2g was launched in 1991.

For me that's the value - a low bandwidth network that is reliable and continues to be supported.

Re: 2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

#105

Post by wkjagt »

cogman10 wrote: post #101
sheepscreek wrote: post #100

It’s a positive thing, tbh. I wish the number was bigger. Our desire to switch to the hottest new thing has a significant environmental impact. People don’t need the fastest available mobile internet for checking mails or streaming videos at 1 Mbps. They don’t need the fastest PCs for using Google docs. We don’t need massive pickup trucks for doing grocery runs or even hauling passengers around. It’s fair for anyone…

I see environmental impact of electronics frequently mentioned but, gotta be honest, I'm not sure I really buy that there is a major environmental impact there. Even if someone is getting a brand new phone every year, that's how much plastic and silicon? In a year? Compare that to the daily disposable plastics just for food. Or the amount of plastics for shipping and storing goods.

It’s not just the materials in the phone itself. It’s the whole production process.

Re: 2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

#106

Post by afavour »

bArray wrote: post #75

> Furthermore, the study also reveals 21% of those with a 3G handset aren’t willing to upgrade, and will simply continue to use their phone without internet connectivity. My bet would be that these are mostly devices given to children to watch Youtube and what-not. > However, calls and texts will continue to work despite the 3G switch off, as 2G won’t be fully switched off until 2033 the latest. This is because 2G is…

> Is it really that much overhead to keep 2G networks operating?

Network spectrum, perhaps? Once 2G is switched off that spectrum can be repurposes for other stuff, and it's a finite resource.

Re: 2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

#107

Post by ksec »

To put in a little context. First 4G iPhone was iPhone 5, released on Sep 2012. 4G here is straightly LTE+ and not anything else. And the first 4G enabled Smartphone was released in 2010 by HTC.

By 2015. All Smartphone from major manufacture, including Apple has a top to bottom LTE capable Line Up.

i.e If the phone is 3G only, it is either very old or specifically designed for Voice and SMS only aka old Nokia non-smart phone.

Re: 2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

#108

Post by galleywest200 »

fsckboy wrote: post #45
Longhanks wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine if Apple or Google were retroactively removing a feature. The shitstorm would be outrageous. Where I'm from, the same discussion appears every two years, when the government tries once more to shutdown FM radio. Luckily, they always get shut down by the people. Maybe don't try to shut down public services that millions of people actually rely on.

> when the government tries once more to shutdown FM radio in the US, what killed FM radio is the death of independent stations with local DJs, replaced by nationwide corporate homogeneity

May I suggest KEXP? Lister powered radio station. They have many unique shows throughout the week focusing on all sorts of genres. KEXP is broadcast in Seattle on 90.3FM, and coming to the Bay Area on 92.7FM in 2024. You can also listen live online at https://kexp.org/, and they also keep their last two weeks of programming on their archive here: https://www.kexp.org/archive/.

Re: 2.7M Brits still use a 3G only handset

#110

Post by mattl »

galleywest200 wrote: post #108
fsckboy wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> when the government tries once more to shutdown FM radio in the US, what killed FM radio is the death of independent stations with local DJs, replaced by nationwide corporate homogeneity

May I suggest KEXP? Lister powered radio station. They have many unique shows throughout the week focusing on all sorts of genres. KEXP is broadcast in Seattle on 90.3FM, and coming to the Bay Area on 92.7FM in 2024. You can also listen live online at https://kexp.org/ , and they also keep their last two weeks of programming on their archive here: https://www.kexp.org/archive/ .

There's also Pacifica radio https://pacificanetwork.org which has a few stations around the country, but including WBAI https://wbai.org which has had a hacker-themed and hacker-led show on the air regularly since 1989. https://2600.com/offthehook/archive_ra.html
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