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Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

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Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#101
post #2

FYI, that API requires entitlements to be used, which are only available if you request them from Apple and justify their use. It's not a general-purpose API any app can use.

That’s almost worse that it’s kind of a side door to the users rights. That’s generally only available to groups with the resources or know how to get it.

I understand it’s not ubiquitous.

Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#102
Which popular apps use that? Is it possible to check this?

Like most here, I don’t have Wechat or Alipay installed. But I’m interested in e.g. Instagram, Facebook, Whatsapp, Twitter, Tiktok, Snapchat, Chrome, Firefox, Photoshop, Lightroom, etc.

Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#103
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> com.apple.developer.networking.HotspotHelper Where do you revoke this entitlement on iOS? Settings → Privacy & Security → Local Network? Or is this something else?

General > Reset > Reset Location and Privacy Settings

You didn't grant any location access in the first place, so why would this work?

Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#104
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does apple get to decide which app gets automatic access to my private data, on my device, without needing to ask me?

FWIW I used WeChat a few years ago and at that point it definitely asked for local network access (which is what this article is about; a mechanism for collecting SSIDs which can then later be correlated to locations). If there is an entitlement, it is as of yet unclear whether it means a consent dialog/privacy toggle or not. IIRC an entitlement only means you can ask for this sort of access, not get it automatically…

> FWIW I used WeChat a few years ago and at that point it definitely asked for local network access (which is what this article is about; a mechanism for collecting SSIDs which can then later be correlated to locations).

Is that what "local network access" means? I thought that was for controlling network connections to LAN ips and/or to send multicast packets (eg. mdns).

Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#105
Reading through the linked docs, this API seems to specifically be for apps created by owners of WiFi hotspots to help users connect to those hotspots (https://developer.apple.com/documentation/networkextension/h...).

> NEHotspotHelper allows your app to participate in the process of authenticating with hotspot networks, that is, Wi-Fi networks where the user must interact with the network to gain access to the wider Internet.

> NEHotspotHelper is only useful for hotspot integration. There are both technical and business restrictions that prevent it from being used for other tasks, such as accessory integration or Wi-Fi based location. Before using NEHotspotHelper, you must first be granted a special entitlement (com.apple.developer.networking.HotspotHelper) by Apple.

Which makes sense, but then why exactly are apps like WeChat and Alipay granted this entitlement?

Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#106
post #62

Whether the user is aware and opt _in_ is the issue, right? But all of the network signals that are triggered by web applications, phone apps, OS, isn't it almost always possible to get SOME information about a user's geo location? There's a theory that Silk Road's Ross Ulbricht leaked his location via a Captcha on a website, despite actively covering his tracks. I think Bitcoin's Satoshi is/was an Australian bloke l…

>There's a theory that Silk Road's Ross Ulbricht leaked his location via a Captcha on a website, despite actively covering his tracks.

How?

Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#107
post #3

TL;DR: Apps can access the nearby Wi-Fi hotspot SSID and MAC addresses through an API that is intended to help with connecting to hotspots. Then they can use this info to look-up in databases that collect SSIDs based on their locations. Seems like a valid concern, though the author's writing style can be off putting since has a tone with an agenda. However, AFAIK apps need to declare the use of this API and have a go…

i wouldn't be worried about my flashlight app tracking me, i'd be worried about the large players who probably GET the use of this API, google facebook etc etc.

Except that there are data collection SDK companies where you can get paid as a developer in exchange for installing an SDK that will send customer data to the company. It's one way to monetize an app a little bit more.

Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#108
post #2

FYI, that API requires entitlements to be used, which are only available if you request them from Apple and justify their use. It's not a general-purpose API any app can use.

> that API requires entitlements to be used

Lately I've witnessed a number of apps asking for Local Network permission ("Foo would like to find and connect to devices on your local network") when they have no business doing so in any possible way that I can think of.

Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#109
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least in the early days, every iPhone maintained a local lookup table between ssids and gps coordinates in a SQLite database. https://www.networkworld.com/article/752872/security-apple-o...

That doesn’t mean seeing an SSID means you are at exactly that location. If you are in a city you see 50 SSIDs at any given moment. Are you at those 50 locations at the same time? No. Is there a way to triangulate where you are exactly? No, its unreliable and not an exact science.

you're all over these comments trying to convince everyone that SSIDs can't be used to determine location, yet you don't know how triangulation works?

are you trolling?

Re: Apple allows some iOS apps to track user locations via lists of nearby SSIDs

#110
post #105

Reading through the linked docs, this API seems to specifically be for apps created by owners of WiFi hotspots to help users connect to those hotspots ( https://developer.apple.com/documentation/networkextension/h... ). > NEHotspotHelper allows your app to participate in the process of authenticating with hotspot networks, that is, Wi-Fi networks where the user must interact with the network to gain access to the wid…

Because the Chinese market is too important. For wechat you can maybe argue that it's a "super app" and probably also can be used to connect to wifi hotspots, but for alipay I fail to come up with an explanation..
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