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Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#101

Post by dghughes »

ljm wrote: post #88
TeMPOraL wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's so common-sense about it? Or even commendable? Earth's carrying capacity is a problem to be solved, there are many viable solutions that can be executed in parallel, and it doesn't really sound like a big challenge relative to getting life extension working in the first place. Really, it's just bewildering to me that having a death wish is considered common-sense, normal viewpoint.

Is it really a death wish? Immortality being a curse is a common trope. Hell, even surviving to 90 or 100 can be its own kind of hell for those whose life is being unnaturally preserved for the sake of those who can't or won't let go.

I'm 54 and I can't stand most of people and society now or at least here in what is mainly US/Canada. I can't imagine what it would be like at 100 if I make it that far.

Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#102

Post by TeMPOraL »

ljm wrote: post #88
TeMPOraL wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's so common-sense about it? Or even commendable? Earth's carrying capacity is a problem to be solved, there are many viable solutions that can be executed in parallel, and it doesn't really sound like a big challenge relative to getting life extension working in the first place. Really, it's just bewildering to me that having a death wish is considered common-sense, normal viewpoint.

Is it really a death wish? Immortality being a curse is a common trope. Hell, even surviving to 90 or 100 can be its own kind of hell for those whose life is being unnaturally preserved for the sake of those who can't or won't let go.

> Immortality being a curse is a common trope.

This is one of those cases where one shouldn't generalize from fictional evidence. Immortality as curse is a very lazy trope that breaks down upon casual inspection.

> even surviving to 90 or 100 can be its own kind of hell for those whose life is being unnaturally preserved for the sake of those who can't or won't let go.

That is indeed true, both in fiction and reality, but it's not the kind of immortality that's under discussion. Obviously being forever locked in a state of agony, in a failing body, is something no one wants.

Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#103

Post by hombre_fatal »

serf wrote: post #55
johnnyanmac wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

cool sentiment, but becoming increasingly harder to do. So many people an too many to not discount that some crazies will pop in. Few public/semi-public figures can just keep their contact info around freely. Even if it all is in good faith, they will just get so many mails about business inquiries, recruits, media reqesting interviews, academia, etc. Very hard for little Timmy to ask a quick question via email these…

emailing famous people or their handlers is kind of a hobby of mine. over about a hundred emails i've received about 30 replies. the surprising thing to me is that their level of 'fame' has little to do with whether or not they reply to me. I've received replies from some famously impressive people, and have been ignored by some real 'niche' ones. I have a suspicion that there is a bit of a bi-modal distribution betw…

One of my hobbies as a preteen was to mail a hand written letter to famous people to ask for their autograph.

I don’t remember what made me start doing it nor what my letters said but I have dozens of autographed pictures of famous people from Elton John to John Stamos just from asking.

Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#104

Post by dzek69 »

okr wrote: post #85
serf wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

emailing famous people or their handlers is kind of a hobby of mine. over about a hundred emails i've received about 30 replies. the surprising thing to me is that their level of 'fame' has little to do with whether or not they reply to me. I've received replies from some famously impressive people, and have been ignored by some real 'niche' ones. I have a suspicion that there is a bit of a bi-modal distribution betw…

A hobby? Sounds like stalking to me. :)

stalking, because he had sent one e-mail to many people across some time?

if he'd constantly sending one person dozes on messages, maybe demanding a response or something, that would be stalking

Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#105

Post by TeMPOraL »

ChrisRR wrote: post #99
TeMPOraL wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's so common-sense about it? Or even commendable? Earth's carrying capacity is a problem to be solved, there are many viable solutions that can be executed in parallel, and it doesn't really sound like a big challenge relative to getting life extension working in the first place. Really, it's just bewildering to me that having a death wish is considered common-sense, normal viewpoint.

I think you overestimate how common common sense is And it's not a death wish. I think a lot of us realise that we probably don't offer a net positive to this earth, that our individual existence probably uses more resource than it provides. So technically that means that the earth would be better off without us, but that's not a death wish. We're not saying we're actively going to kill ourselves

> I think a lot of us realise that we probably don't offer a net positive to this earth, that our individual existence probably uses more resource than it provides. So technically that means that the earth would be better off without us, but that's not a death wish.

I don't believe most people go as far as reasoning this way - I was thinking more about internalizing "the natural order of things" / "circle of life" stuff too much.

The kind of thought pattern you described can be, for some, a rational and accurate view of their circumstances. It can also be a sign of depression (especially internalizing the "earth would be better off without me/us" part). It can, unfortunately, be also both.

Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#106

Post by ddj231 »

ChrisRR wrote: post #99
TeMPOraL wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's so common-sense about it? Or even commendable? Earth's carrying capacity is a problem to be solved, there are many viable solutions that can be executed in parallel, and it doesn't really sound like a big challenge relative to getting life extension working in the first place. Really, it's just bewildering to me that having a death wish is considered common-sense, normal viewpoint.

I think you overestimate how common common sense is And it's not a death wish. I think a lot of us realise that we probably don't offer a net positive to this earth, that our individual existence probably uses more resource than it provides. So technically that means that the earth would be better off without us, but that's not a death wish. We're not saying we're actively going to kill ourselves

It seems this fundamentally misunderstands human value. The value of a human is not whether they provide more resources than they consume. Imagine applying this to others, or a government systematically ridding citizens that are net negative. That would be a horrible genocide.

This again reveals the wisdom of very basic biblical truths, like “all men are made in the image of God”. Meaning all humans have value, a special value different from animals and plants

Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#107

Post by jollofricepeas »

kome wrote: post #73
upwardbound wrote: post #68

Woz is one of the most selfless people I've ever met. At a conference he keynoted for (SynBioBeta), he said that even if immortality were available to him, he wouldn't want to live forever, because he'd be taking up a spot in the Earth's population carrying capacity, and even if that's just one spot of many billions, he wouldn't feel right taking up that spot, when he's already lived his life and now it's time for so…

It's surprising to me that such an obviously common-sense viewpoint is being treated as if it's extraordinary. Nonetheless, it's commendable that he hasn't succumbed to the delusions of grandeur and immortality.

Good point.

We say many altruistic things when we’re happy and healthy.

There’s a great opinion article from a doctor that says people faced with death that come into a hospital usually change their minds about receiving care that would prolong their lives.

I have seen this many times as a caretaker for my own family members.

It’s only at the doorstep of death that we know how we truly feel about death itself.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/03/opinion/advance-directive...

Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#108

Post by jwr »

Best wishes to Woz.

He is one of very few people I genuinely admire and look up to. So much unlike the current crop of leaders-a*holes (like Musk, SBF, and a bunch of other fraudsters not even worth mentioning that were so in vogue just a couple of years ago).

Apart from his impressive technical achievements (and they are impressive, they are his, and they are worth learning about!), his personality and style are something to be admired.

Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#109

Post by Hoasi »

krisoft wrote: post #94
ljm wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really a death wish? Immortality being a curse is a common trope. Hell, even surviving to 90 or 100 can be its own kind of hell for those whose life is being unnaturally preserved for the sake of those who can't or won't let go.

> Immortality being a curse is a common trope. The silliness of the trope starts with the notion that once you have gone immortal you can't go back. Somehow you are stuck yearning for the sweet release of death. In reality life is extremely fragile, maintaining the right conditions to support it requires constant effort. There is no reason to think that any future scientific advance will alter this fundamental fact.…

> Also, "forever" doesn't happen all at once. Give me immortality, and then check in with me yearly if I still want it. I will let you know once I'm over it.

Immortality as a subscription service—brilliant!

Re: Steve Wozniak suffers minor stroke

#110

Post by sgu999 »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #75
kome wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's surprising to me that such an obviously common-sense viewpoint is being treated as if it's extraordinary. Nonetheless, it's commendable that he hasn't succumbed to the delusions of grandeur and immortality.

What's so common-sense about it? Or even commendable? Earth's carrying capacity is a problem to be solved, there are many viable solutions that can be executed in parallel, and it doesn't really sound like a big challenge relative to getting life extension working in the first place. Really, it's just bewildering to me that having a death wish is considered common-sense, normal viewpoint.

> Really, it's just bewildering to me that having a death wish is considered common-sense, normal viewpoint.

I wonder if being selfless in that sense is not actually the "norm" when we consider most of the people who live and lived. In-between all the ones willing to sacrifice themselves for a descendant, a cause, those with a tightrope life, those who have spiritual beliefs etc.

Most people I know are at ease with their death, which is very different from having a death wish.

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