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Tell HN: Automatic fraud detection is making my life hell

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Re: Tell HN: Automatic fraud detection is making my life hell

#101

Post by SuperNinKenDo »

Habgdnv wrote: post #44

I wholeheartedly support digitization, having been involved in the realms of development, system administration, and everything computer-related since my early days. However, what irks me is when I'm bound to use products or services from providers who fail to execute their roles properly despite being compensated for it. A recent incident at my child's school serves as a pertinent example. They transitioned from a t…

Well in my opinion, this is what it means to support digitisation. It means accepting that these situations will become more and more commonplace. It is simply the price you pay.

In your other comment you mention that people handling email should be familiarising themselves properly with RFCs. Yeah. Maybe. Probably actually you're right.

Putting aside the problem of ehether they actually _have to_ or _will_ for a second. Do you think it's reasonable that the people at your child's school will? No, of course not. And they're the ones who will choose these providers. Not you.

To support digitisation is to support the tyranny of technical ignorance in every facet of our lives.

Re: Tell HN: Automatic fraud detection is making my life hell

#102

Post by m_fayer »

0cf8612b2e1e wrote: post #80
kevstev wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing I try to do to avoid this is to always make a purchase at the airport before I go overseas. This seems to calm down the algos a bit. I used to go through this a bunch too.

I do the same, and again when I land. Try to double down on signaling to the black box.

That is a great idea and as another frequent traveler I’ll take this to heart.

While shaking my head and muttering to myself that I guess this is where we are now.

Re: Tell HN: Automatic fraud detection is making my life hell

#104

Post by Aachen »

dakial1 wrote: post #12

This happens because the cost of developing (or buying) good software and people to build a decent anti-fraud system is very clear to measure and the impact of the false positives is not. Also, as credit card fraud is usually the bank's responsibility, it makes sense for the leaders of that area to go towards more false positives than false negatives. But it does not need to be that way and the government can and sho…

The cost of false positives is obvious though: lost custom?

Re: Tell HN: Automatic fraud detection is making my life hell

#105

Post by Aachen »

duskwuff wrote: post #84
tomschlick wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's openvpn you can just port forward from your router to the RaspberryPi's internal ip address. If it's a webserver you can do the same, or use something like Cloudflare tunnels to expose the service.

Or, like the original post said, use Tailscale, which can punch a hole through the NAT for you.

Port forwarding is easy and self-reliant compared to using a third party's free service though

Not saying that's for everyone but I do feel like the default should be to click the two buttons in your router interface and third parties a fallback option or conscious choice. Probably just as quick as signing up for tailscale, if it weren't for that all routers feel like they need to reinvent a UI so it's never twice the same

Re: Tell HN: Automatic fraud detection is making my life hell

#107

Post by X6S1x6Okd1st »

deepsun wrote: post #106

Well, you cannot blame companies from protecting their businesses, as long as you don't have to use them. Just use cash. However, if that becomes problematic (like WeChat in China), then things go bad very quickly.

> it's hard to carry cash from my country (for "security" reasons, as most airports limit how much cash you can carry).

Re: Tell HN: Automatic fraud detection is making my life hell

#108

Post by instagib »

CaliforniaKarl wrote: post #82
instagib wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is it’s in a foreign country which is about to pass up china for population. More people - more scams and pickpockets. The way we pay for things in the USA is very different. You pay with QR codes or apps. Most places in the US has Apple Pay broken sticker on them, does not accept any other method, wants cash, or a credit card. The verification and such required are difficult. Most cards do not allow you…

> Most places in the US has Apple Pay broken sticker on them Citation needed. At least in my experience, over the last 12 months, the last time I saw "Apple Pay broken" was at one location, affected all tap-to-pay, and lasted for maybe 2 days.

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/255199188

I have seen them at Starbucks at airports and a few restaurants. A few people have issues with their Apple Pay. It’s probably an issue with the customer’s phone or setup and the employee wants to get on with their day, then they post a sign.

I hope it gets wider adoption.

https://nitter.net/search?f=tweets&q=apple+pay+not+working&s...

Re: Tell HN: Automatic fraud detection is making my life hell

#109

Post by spacebanana7 »

anish_m wrote: post #95

I worked on one of these Fraud detection systems at Airbnb. Statistically, You are in 1% population with the your usage patterns. For most part, all ML models which are used to detect fraud have to take a trade off between precision/recall - meaning how often they let good guys suffer vs let bad guys in. BUt what most of these systems are missing is the appeal and escape path.

> But what most of these systems are missing is the appeal and escape path.

Are there any such systems that do have effective escape/appeal paths? If so, what do they look like?

Re: Tell HN: Automatic fraud detection is making my life hell

#110

Post by cycomanic »

One of my favorites amongst this stupid platforms is PayPal. I have moved countries/continents. Once I forgot to close my account before moving (still had some $100 on it), after I could never access it as it wanted a phone call to my non existent former phone number to confirm this is really me, ok my fault. Now I have moved again when I want to pay with PayPal I can't because my account is associated to a different country. It is impossible to change the country. The FAQ say you have to close and reopen a new account), but if I try to close the account I get to an error page. This would all be not so bad if it wasn't for the merchants who use PayPal and disallow payment without an account. In the end the easiest was to just open a new account with a different email.

Somebody mentioned Google services, and that was a big issue as well. I still have bank accounts in my former country of residence, so I need access to apps from that country (the 2fa App that is used there). On the other hand I need to access some apps here (school notifications, banks...) Google obviously knows better than to allow me to get apps from different regions. The solution was again to just create another account. The whole system is really screwed up. I'm not sure what they are actually trying to prevent, considering that in the end one can work around the restrictions quite easily with multiple accounts, but one would think with the world moving closer together these things would actually get easier.

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