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Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

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Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#101

Post by parthdesai »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #8
jansan wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the Peace Prize has been very strange of late in general. Remember when a man received the Nobel Peace Prize for not being George W. Bush?

You could at least make the case that Obama promoted -- indeed, in a sense, embodied -- "fraternity between nations," for he was incredibly popular with most of America's allies. (See, e.g., his "rock star" reception in Germany.) Even its enemies were at worst ambivalent towards him personally, and at best they were hopeful that he'd bring about positive change. In this sense, he, at minimum, shored up the self-image…

> So I thought it was weird, sure, but I could somehow rationalize it.

Not if you happened to be a person in Libya/Syria/Afghanistan or a few other middle eastern countries.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#102

Post by dmbche »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #8
jansan wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the Peace Prize has been very strange of late in general. Remember when a man received the Nobel Peace Prize for not being George W. Bush?

You could at least make the case that Obama promoted -- indeed, in a sense, embodied -- "fraternity between nations," for he was incredibly popular with most of America's allies. (See, e.g., his "rock star" reception in Germany.) Even its enemies were at worst ambivalent towards him personally, and at best they were hopeful that he'd bring about positive change. In this sense, he, at minimum, shored up the self-image…

I think they might be refering to Al Gore instead of Obama?

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#103

Post by binarymax »

It would be nice if instead of everyone hating on the prize, we could take a moment and reflect. Think of what this woman and many other women trapped in these regimes are going through, the sacrifices they've made, and the bravery they show to try to make things better.

Think the prize is politicized and corrupt? Whatever - it's not about you or your opinion.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#104

Post by tgv »

pipo234 wrote: post #12
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #2

The prize is supposedly awarded to those who have "done the most or the best work for fraternity between nations, for the abolition or reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promotion of peace congresses." Hmmm. Well. I don't quite see how formenting revolution fits the bill, but the Peace Prize has been very strange of late in general. By its own lights, I don't see a single person or entity who would…

The Nobel Peace Prize has historically been surrounded by the kind of ambivalent feelings you allude to. To name one: Hume & Trimble (1998) was considered ironic because it was viewed as kind of reward for ceasing violence they initially caused. Similar remarks were made in 1993 about Mandela and De Klerk. It can even be argued that Gorbachev and Carter had blood on their hands before becoming saints. Maybe this kind…

My newspaper had an interview with a former judge, and he said something along the lines of: if it doesn't chafe, it will become irrelevant. So tend to prefer somewhat controversial figures over safe choices.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#105

Post by trimethylpurine »

AnonCoward42 wrote: post #95
trimethylpurine wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is because civil rights are a Western ideology. They certainly didn't come from ISIS' views on women. Nor from Russia and China, who supported them. Snowden defected to Russia, see above about supporting ISIS. Assange and Manning's exposure literally cost the lives of Afghan families who were working against AQ, another regime that openly oppresses its people's civil rights. I think you might need to have a hard…

> This is because civil rights are a Western ideology. They certainly didn't come from ISIS' views on women. Nor from Russia and China, who supported them. How do you come to the conclusion that Russia and China support ISIS?

The insurgency was armed with Russian and Chinese equipment that was given to Iraq between 2003 and 2009.

You can read about the Iraqi Insurgency for more information.

But more generally, US, China, Russia have all been fighting/arming proxy wars over there for around 50 years.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#106

Post by zaphirplane »

zvmaz wrote: post #11
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #2

The prize is supposedly awarded to those who have "done the most or the best work for fraternity between nations, for the abolition or reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promotion of peace congresses." Hmmm. Well. I don't quite see how formenting revolution fits the bill, but the Peace Prize has been very strange of late in general. By its own lights, I don't see a single person or entity who would…

> Well. I don't quite see how formenting revolution fits the bill Oppressive regimes like to use these sorts of rhetorical ploys to discredit social movements. Do people under authoritarian regimes have any agency? Or are they just puppets to foreign machinations?

You are arguing the work done is good, which doesnt mean it should win or be included in every category. Keep hammering how horrible dictators are or child illiteracy is just shouting think of the children meme.

Would it surprise you if she won Nobel prize for chemistry for advocating freedoms ? It would surprise me

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#107

Post by dotnet00 »

tibbydudeza wrote: post #96
dotnet00 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's only convincing if you ignore the mass rioting that happens every other election cycle when the popular liberal (relative to Iran, eg he still hates America, but thinks maybe women should be given more freedom) candidate who promises reform gets removed from the ballot. Having seen the rioting and resulting crackdowns in person, it's absurd to say that the people are particularly happy with the state of things…

Like Jan 06th in the US where a fairly significant chunk of voters still believe that the election was stolen ? I think there is liberal minority of young people but reckon the majority of Iranians were not happy with the Pahlavi regime either that the CIA engineered on them. And I did mention that the clerics needs to approve all election candidates btw.

Thanks for clarifying that you were only putting up a facade of being unbiased.

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#108

Post by bnralt »

LindeBuzoGray wrote: post #39
archon1410 wrote: post #7

I feel the Nobel prize was less for fighting for women's rights, and more for fighting against an anti-American, anti-Western government. For some reason, I don't see the award ever going to a rights activist fighting against the Saudi, Pakistani, or any other American-allied regimes. I of course don't ever see it going to someone fighting against the American regime itself, and its mass surveillance and war crimes,…

Also Iran in 1953 had a prime Minister Mosaddegh, who wanted to nationalize Iran's oil. The UK (and US) sought the support of right-wing mullahs, then overthrew the prime minister and replaced him with a dictator. Then the CIA helped SAVAK kill off the secular left for the next few decades. Eventually even the right-wing clerics and bazaari grew tired of foreign interference and threw the western powers out.

> Also Iran in 1953 had a prime Minister Mosaddegh, who wanted to nationalize Iran's oil.

Iranian oil was nationalized; in 1951 the National Iranian Oil Company took control, and retained it even after Mossadegh’s ouster (even up to today).

> The UK (and US) sought the support of right-wing mullahs, then overthrew the prime minister and replaced him with a dictator.

First, by this point in time Mossadegh had dissolved parliament and was ruling by fiat based on a rigged plebiscite (he claimed that 99.9% of Iranians had voted to give him control of the country[1]). Second, he wasn’t replaced with a dictator. The Shah had been in power since the Soviet Union and the U.K. had forced his father to abdicate over a decade before, and had been in a power struggle with the Majlis for quite some time by that point.

> Eventually even the right-wing clerics and bazaari grew tired of foreign interference and threw the western powers out.

The Shah was (mostly) friendly with the West, but he was hardly a puppet. He was the one who got OPEC to double their prices during the 1973 oil crisis, which hit the West pretty hard. Here's how PBS put it[2]:

> The final blow came in December when the Shah of Iran, ostensibly a U.S. ally, took advantage of American impotence and persuaded the rest of the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) to more than double the price of a barrel of oil from $5.11 to $11.65.

[1] https://www.nytimes.com/1953/08/04/archives/mossadegh-gets-9... [2] http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/tehranbureau/2012/06...

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#109

Post by nobodynobody »

user3939382 wrote: post #88
trimethylpurine wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is because civil rights are a Western ideology. They certainly didn't come from ISIS' views on women. Nor from Russia and China, who supported them. Snowden defected to Russia, see above about supporting ISIS. Assange and Manning's exposure literally cost the lives of Afghan families who were working against AQ, another regime that openly oppresses its people's civil rights. I think you might need to have a hard…

> Snowden defected to Russia To add context, Snowden became trapped in Russia when the US State Department decided to cancel his passport while he was at an airport there on the way out of Russia. > Assange and Manning's exposure literally cost the lives of Afghan families Exposure like the footage they revealed of US drones killing innocent civilians? > The U.S. post-9/11 wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen, Syria, and…

[flagged]

Re: Narges Mohammadi wins 2023 Nobel Peace Prize

#110

Post by sorenjan »

bluish29 wrote: post #45
archon1410 wrote: post #7

I feel the Nobel prize was less for fighting for women's rights, and more for fighting against an anti-American, anti-Western government. For some reason, I don't see the award ever going to a rights activist fighting against the Saudi, Pakistani, or any other American-allied regimes. I of course don't ever see it going to someone fighting against the American regime itself, and its mass surveillance and war crimes,…

My favorite Nobel peace prize goes to Abiy Ahmed who was awarded 2019 prize. He went to Sweden took the prize, deliver a speech then a couple of months later he went on a streak of atrocious in Ethiopia [1]. You name it ( mass killing, rape, genocide..etc). Also take into consideration that any head of state, prime minister or cabinet member in any government can nominate people for the prize (A lot of other people c…

The peace prize is awarded in Norway.
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