Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

growth.design

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 359 posts

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#101

Post by carimura »

GeekyBear wrote: post #60
giancarlostoro wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was going to say, nobody believes in any privacy Meta alleges. Even when they do E2EE they still collect anything else about you that they can.

Nobody believes anything Meta or Google have to say about privacy. Google is currently trying to sell additional ways to spy on users built into the newest version of Chrome as a "privacy sandbox". > all of Google's documentation about this feature feels like it was written on opposite day, with Google calling the browser-based advertising platform "a significant step on the path towards a fundamentally more private…

Correction: "Nobody who regularly reads Hacker News believes anything Meta or Google have to say about privacy."

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#102

Post by 95014_refugee »

Timber-6539 wrote: post #94
goalieca wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple does not have a tracking pixel on half the popular web. Apple's main source of income is through luxury hardware and subscription services. Facebook sells your information and attention to willing buyers.

What the difference between Meta's tracking pixel and Apple's IDFA?

Meta wants to know everything it can about you because other people will pay them for the information.

Apple doesn’t.

It’s really that simple.

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#103

Post by glitchc »

innagadadavida wrote: post #95
nicce wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple's ad business, however, is growing all the time. And in significant margins. https://www.wired.co.uk/article/apple-is-an-ad-company-now https://www.statista.com/statistics/1330127/apple-ad-revenue...

> In 2022, Apple generated 4.7 billion U.S. dollars with its global advertising business. > By 2022, Facebook's ad revenues had hit $135.94 billion. $4.7B is not a small number but no where close to Facebook’s.

Velocity is often more important than the absolute amount in a business context. If velocity is 100% growth, year over year, it holds true for a couple of years, it's going to draw significant attention.

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#104

Post by smoldesu »

doublerabbit wrote: post #100
soperj wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And Apple now with their ad business. How are they fundamentally different?

I agree. Apple has always had an advertising business, remember apps with ad banners in the early IOS store? However the fundamental difference is that their model is being an hardware company.

Their "ecosystem" model is why we need crowbar legislation like Europe's DMA to force interoperability. Make no mistake, Apple is playing for keeps just as hard as Google is: https://httptoolkit.com/blog/apple-private-access-tokens-att...

All of these companies deserve their due scrutiny. Specifically around the illusion of privacy though, nobody has further to fall than Apple.

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#105

Post by carimura »

daft_pink wrote: post #13

I think it's unfair to compare Facebook actively screwing us to Apple not adopting your proposed metric on their product and passively allowing a very popular app in their app store. Not a huge fan of Apple, but they aren't Facebook.

To be fair they aren't. They are demonstrating how Apple is a willing participant obfuscating the actual privacy monstrosities happening by Meta.

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#106

Post by epistasis »

paulryanrogers wrote: post #97
giantrobot wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple sells services ? That you elect to use and pay for? The nerve of them!

Sorry if the implication wasn't obvious. Once they sell B2C services it's just a matter of time before that too becomes ad supported, then your data (or at least eye balls) are for sale.

Why are dollar-for-service inevitably going to switch to ad supported? I can't imagine the necessity of that, you already have a paying customer.

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#107

Post by carimura »

bugglebeetle wrote: post #92
giancarlostoro wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was going to say, nobody believes in any privacy Meta alleges. Even when they do E2EE they still collect anything else about you that they can.

I also don’t believe any privacy that Apple alleges, given their actions in China, attempts at iCloud scanning, etc. Post-Snowden, it would seem naive to believe in any such assertions, beyond the level of “this might protect me okay against average criminals, assuming I install all the latest updates and use features like lockdown mode.”

Technically they backed down from CSAM scanning after public pressure. Can we say the same thing about Google and/or Meta?

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#108

Post by xtanx »

daft_pink wrote: post #13

I think it's unfair to compare Facebook actively screwing us to Apple not adopting your proposed metric on their product and passively allowing a very popular app in their app store. Not a huge fan of Apple, but they aren't Facebook.

> I think it's unfair to compare Facebook actively screwing us to Apple not adopting your proposed metric

I don't think they were comparing. They were basically saying that Apple is complicit to what Facebook (and others) are doing with regard to data collection.

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#109

Post by dazc »

goalieca wrote: post #71
daft_pink wrote: post #13

I think it's unfair to compare Facebook actively screwing us to Apple not adopting your proposed metric on their product and passively allowing a very popular app in their app store. Not a huge fan of Apple, but they aren't Facebook.

Apple does not have a tracking pixel on half the popular web. Apple's main source of income is through luxury hardware and subscription services. Facebook sells your information and attention to willing buyers.

'Apple's main source of income is through luxury hardware and subscription services.'

So why not keep it that way? I understand the temptation of veering from the path of 'do no evil' but Apple are not exactly short of revenue?

Apple, Google and Meta are currently all three sides of the same coin. Take your pick but don't claim any virtue for doing so.

Re: Apple vs. Meta: The Illusion of Privacy

#110

Post by Timber-6539 »

95014_refugee wrote: post #102
Timber-6539 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What the difference between Meta's tracking pixel and Apple's IDFA?

Meta wants to know everything it can about you because other people will pay them for the information. Apple doesn’t. It’s really that simple.

To my knowledge, Apple has not invented a new form of advertising that works without tracking users.
Post reply on HN