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We are all animals at night

hazlitt.net

101–110 of 295 posts

Re: We are all animals at night

#101
post #96

Beautifully written, even if I don’t necessarily agree with every single point made. Especially towards the end, I feel that she tries to emphasize the nobility and radical nature of this work, taking umbrage at Eric Adam’s use of the word “low-skill” to describe some of these sorts of jobs. But it seems somewhat belied by the fact that, afaict, as soon as she had the means to escape, she did. And the romanticization…

The author didn’t assert that sex work is the only job where women get to call the shots. The author suggested that could be a reason why it’s marginalized. Because if it was legitimized, then women would call the shots.

I did not read it that way and I think that she would have phrased it differently if so.

“an industry where women get to call the shots” she would have said “would get” imo if your interpretation was correct, just as you use ‘would’ in your comment.

I took her to be describing sex work in the present, not some hypothetical future sex work.

Here is the excerpt for those who want to judge for themselves:

‘Unlike sex work, my “good” jobs didn’t threaten to overthrow traditional power structures. Many sex workers, including myself, have long hypothesized that the reason so many people in power work to keep the commercial sex trade marginalized is because they’re threatened by it—by the idea that it’s the only field where women outearn men, that it’s an industry where women get to call the shots, and that women profit off something that men have been told they’re entitled to for free: sex and attention in equal parts. In my experience of the corporate landscape, there was none of this radical power structure, only an upholding of the traditional: men talking and women listening, men in powerful positions getting both credit and profit for the labour of women beneath them’

Re: We are all animals at night

#102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You value self-actualization above food and shelter? Like, have you ever been stuck out at night in the cold and rain without eating all day and thought, "I need to focus on pursuing my passions"?

My guess is that they are asexual, not sure why everyone is jumping to them not requiring food for some reason.

They literally said they believe the pyramid of needs to be upside down, so you'd have self-actualization at the bottom, and food and shelter at the top.

Re: We are all animals at night

#103

Beautifully written, even if I don’t necessarily agree with every single point made. Especially towards the end, I feel that she tries to emphasize the nobility and radical nature of this work, taking umbrage at Eric Adam’s use of the word “low-skill” to describe some of these sorts of jobs. But it seems somewhat belied by the fact that, afaict, as soon as she had the means to escape, she did. And the romanticization…

She also doesn't know how many of those office drones also "paid their dues". But that's a nitpick on an excellent piece of first-person journalism.

Re: We are all animals at night

#104

Let's get this straight. The person blessed with what is basically a panhandling superpower -- an attractive female body -- somehow says her marks , the ones paying $80, have an entitled attitude toward sexual attention. Pause and think about that. Do you think these guys had a Plan B to buy them an English degree? These places conduct zero-sum economic activity. One person loses money, one person gains money, and no…

This place: Money in, nothing out.

If this is the crux of the issue for you, I assume you don't frequent the following places:

- bars

- arcades

- any entertainment venue (concerts, etc)

The impression she seemed to be making was that many of their patrons weren't there for physical gratification but rather a sort of emotional catharsis. Yours is a highly judgmental and uncharitable take.

Re: We are all animals at night

#105
post #97
post #57

I worked long months in the forestry industry (re-planting trees) during university it’s not so tough as sex work but sometimes people throw it in the bag of “low-skill” or “manual labour” jobs as if thought or critical thinking we’re not required. I have to say now working a “real” job now (for salary benefits etc.) I know way more forestry folks who could do my job today (consulting) than current coworkers who coul…

This is how I feel coming from the trades into the offices, my colleagues are often surprised when I say the work we do is easy.

I mean, if this was true, then why do office workers generally earn more?

Re: We are all animals at night

#106
post #57

I worked long months in the forestry industry (re-planting trees) during university it’s not so tough as sex work but sometimes people throw it in the bag of “low-skill” or “manual labour” jobs as if thought or critical thinking we’re not required. I have to say now working a “real” job now (for salary benefits etc.) I know way more forestry folks who could do my job today (consulting) than current coworkers who coul…

I used to weld in a shipyard, and one of the things I miss about it was that literally everyone I worked with was skilled and knowledgeable about our work. There was literally no way to fake being able to do what we did, so all the ego-first blowhards crashed out before they could affect our day-to-day much.

It was refreshing.

Re: We are all animals at night

#107
post #91
post #28

This is very well written and gripping even. I don’t see the negatives other commenters are pointing out. Yes she’s talking about her perceptions born from her clients and years worked. That’s an absolute right for all of us, right? To simply relate the experiences we’ve had. She’s definitely seen a side of humanity that, while seen by many, doesn’t quite often get public visibility-sunlight. And lo and behold, it’s…

> I don’t see the negatives other commenters are pointing out. Yes she’s talking about her perceptions born from her clients and years worked. That’s an absolute right for all of us, right? To simply relate the experiences we’ve had. She's not "simply relating experiences" though. She goes beyond that, turning them into a general sociopolitical claim: > Unlike sex work, my “good” jobs didn’t threaten to overthrow tra…

That, too, is simple. And ok. And ok to agree/disagree.

Re: We are all animals at night

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dues it surprise you that there are people on HN who have gone without food or proper shelter?

Not at all! It would surprise me if someone had gone without food and shelter and then insisted that self-actualization was more important to them when they were cold and hungry.

Why? For the record, in my early twenties I moved to a city, fell in with a bad crowd, was robbed of my savings, and ended up living in my car for a time. I lost almost a pound a day that month. At no point did I start thinking differently, like a reptile or robot (or whatever you're imagining), or stop thinking about myself as a personality or a soul. Soft-science textbooks are manipulative bullshit.

Re: We are all animals at night

#110

Let's get this straight. The person blessed with what is basically a panhandling superpower -- an attractive female body -- somehow says her marks , the ones paying $80, have an entitled attitude toward sexual attention. Pause and think about that. Do you think these guys had a Plan B to buy them an English degree? These places conduct zero-sum economic activity. One person loses money, one person gains money, and no…

This place: Money in, nothing out. If this is the crux of the issue for you, I assume you don't frequent the following places: - bars - arcades - any entertainment venue (concerts, etc) The impression she seemed to be making was that many of their patrons weren't there for physical gratification but rather a sort of emotional catharsis. Yours is a highly judgmental and uncharitable take.

>... I assume you don't frequent the following places

I also assume they've never really been out much around 2AM.

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