Live data from Hacker News

The past is not true

sive.rs

101–110 of 362 posts

Re: The past is not true

#101
This reminds me of the "second arrow." A buddhist idea.

What happened in the story, the ground truth, is real. There was an accident, people were injured.

That this story really highlights is the danger of a second arrow that is not that we tell ourselves stories about the past. The danger is that we tell ourselves stories so false they cause undue suffering.

The point isn't that the past isn't true. The issue is the story.

Re: The past is not true

#103

This reminds me of the "second arrow." A buddhist idea. What happened in the story, the ground truth, is real. There was an accident, people were injured. That this story really highlights is the danger of a second arrow that is not that we tell ourselves stories about the past. The danger is that we tell ourselves stories so false they cause undue suffering. The point isn't that the past isn't true. The issue is the…

("undue" suffering, in the sense of "unwarranted", "disproportionate" or "more than your due". "undo" suffering would be removing it or undoing it.)

Re: The past is not true

#104
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oof, as a psychologist that deals a lot with people who were abused and mistreated, this is a pretty big generalization. Yes, as we age we come to see things from a more experienced perspective and the perspectives of the adults we grew up with and change, but going all the way to "that is why it is important to forgive your parents" is a big big step. It is typically a good idea to try to get to forgiveness, you're…

You may have a skewed view of the frequency of that level of abuse, due to the (very important) work you do. When it comes to humans there are exceptions to every rule, but not every single exception needs be called out. Not everything is “problematic” nor worth an “oof”.

It’s simply an example, though a somewhat extreme one, of the problem with the GP’s generalization.

I think it actually relates to the original article. There’s a difference between mere interpretation and what actually happened.

“You should forgive your parents, because one day you’ll be older and see their perspective” collapses “interpretations develop and mature” with “some events are a problem”.

Both can be forgiven and it’s probably a good idea to do so. I think it’s not helpful to generalize in that way.

Also abuse happens a lot. It may not be the majority but it is NOT rare.

I stand by my objection in this case

Re: The past is not true

#105
post #2

In an alternate universe: the lady couldn’t walk, got obese and died of a heart attack 10 years ago. So, the past isn’t true until it is and then, maybe, it’s even worse. Not sure what to make of this story.

Reminds me of: https://thedailyzen.org/2015/03/20/zen-story-maybe/ There is a Taoist story of an old farmer who had worked his crops for many years. One day his horse ran away. Upon hearing the news, his neighbors came to visit. “Such bad luck,” they said sympathetically. “Maybe,” the farmer replied. The next morning the horse returned, bringing with it three other wild horses. “How wonderful,” the neighbors exclaime…

This is a rip off of the story "Ed" told in the TV show "Northern Exposure", but it has always been one of my favorites from that show.

Re: The past is not true

#106
We lose this when everything is recorded forever.

Stated more eloquently: https://twitter.com/BrianRoemmele/status/1681340407857422336...:

“I need to say this, even if it does not make sense until decades ahead:

Human intelligence and a foundation of consciousness is just as much the ability to forget somethings as it is to remember.

We will have to face eternal memories with AI technologies and this will be hard.”

I’d replace AI with just IT in general. Relatedly, I used to believe in digital rot but now I’m not sure. I can for example search all the photos on my phone instantly to return images with a given text string. So the technology is improving to comprehend any data format and effectively retain its data.

Re: The past is not true

#107
I feel like the internet has really made the fault ones of our memories very apparent. I have a lot of old memories that I will think about and then try to research the event online and realize a lot of my memories are impossible because of the actual timeline of events.

Re: The past is not true

#109
> Seems we had both been told the accident was our fault, and had spent eighteen years feeling bad about it.

Did they both have the same insurance company?

Re: The past is not true

#110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is interesting! What do you make of retrocausal effects in "image exposure" experiments, and other psi related phenomena. I'm curious if you have ideas for a physical theory that speaks to precognition and remove viewing?

What are these image exposure experiments?

I'm no scholar, so I may be missing crucial papers, but here are some:

- https://www.apa.org/pubs/journals/features/psp-a0021524.pdf (original experiments)

- https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4706048/ (replications review)

- https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&d... (review of related evidence)

Here's something more far out I just found trying to connect physical theories to some of this: https://old.hessdalen.org/sse/program/Antonella.pdf

Some related light discussion of similar issues and intersection of physics and consciousness: https://quantumphysics-consciousness.eu/index.php/en/2022/06...

And a few other ones:

- https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4141237/ (review of many experiments)

- https://arxiv.org/pdf/1111.6584.pdf (discussion of possibly physics)

Post reply on HN