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Proof you can do hard things

blog.nateliason.com

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Re: Proof you can do hard things

#101

Post by rramadass »

WesleyJohnson wrote: post #46

I lost interest in school around the 10th or 11th grade. I never took any math classes beyond what was required to graduate way back in '96 in Florida. I also didn't go to college. I've been a professional web developer since 2005 and a development manager (who still codes) since 2017. I don't understand the first thing about Calculus or even logarithms. I'm sure if I did, I'd probably be a better developer. I've had…

> I need to go back to the basics and work my way up; I've lost a lot of it. Where do I start?

One very good place to start is Precalculus Mathematics in a Nutshell: Geometry, Algebra, Trigonometry by George F. Simmons (less than 150 pages!).

Re: Proof you can do hard things

#102

Post by bruce511 »

This resonates a lot with me. At school I coasted, ignored all home work, never studied, and was a consistent C. I was continually told I could fo better by putting in some work (an objective viewpoint I agreed with.)

But i had better things to do. I started programming in grade 7, from a book, with a Apple 2 (circa 1982). There were no forums, no Internet just me and a thin booket that came with the computer, plus later, the odd magazine.

It was never "hard", but it was fun. It taught me how to build things, how to approach problems, how to throw something away and make things better. How to imagine.

Ultimately I would study comp Sci- people would teach me the right way to program, and 40 years later it's still my career. As I predicted at the time (somewhat obnoxiously to my then teachers, sorry Mrs Hodge), I had better things to do than raise my Geography score from a C to an A.

School is important, but finding something you enjoy, where "work" feels like "fun" is the truely "gifted child".

Re: Proof you can do hard things

#103

Post by gmadsen »

m463 wrote: post #79
gmadsen wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

using those "data stuffs" are usually based on calculus. Statistics and probability are both defined in terms of calculus. calculus is the most basic of mathematical machinery, that it is essentially a requirement to do anything else.

Are probability and statistics really practically based on calculus? Most math curriculums do not have a calculus requirement to take statistics.

for actual understanding, yes it is. The most basic important results, the law of large numbers, and the central limit theorem both require calculus to understand.

if you make a class without calculus, it is essentially just a bag of tricks and surface level understanding

Re: Proof you can do hard things

#104

Post by anon-3988 »

wwarner wrote: post #31

I like the idea, but I’m gonna say that (a) calculus is more than a good challenge and (b) math is actually easy. To understand how things actually work, you need math, especially calculus. Deep learning? Calculus. Statistics? Calculus. Finance? Calculus. Physics? Calculus. Mech E, robotics, earth science, econ? Calculus. Second, calculus, like all math, is easy. Like that’s the point, it’s the science of simple thin…

>Second, calculus, like all math, is easy. Like that’s the point, it’s the science of simple things. That math is competitive and presented as a cryptic challenge is beside the point — it is designed to make it possible for anyone to reason for themselves and solve problems. The sense of impatience and criticism around math is totally unwarranted and isn’t good for anyone.

lol, typical HN answer. Mathematics is not "easy", it is a niche; some people are good at, some are average, some are bad. Expecting every person to be able to do math is folly. People will fail. People already fail at memorizing math concepts and literally just applying said concept by plugging the numbers around. Some people just don't "get" it, I know I don't "get" probability, but is pretty good at other branches of math like group theory and calculus. To some people, deriving derivatives is basically black magic, but to me it's pretty intuitive.

Thus, if the world economy relies on people being good at probability then I am screwed. Fortunately for me, the world economy somehow relies on people being good at writing texts on a computer to tell it what to do (programming). I personally think programming is piss easy (its the actual problem being solved that is hard, programming is just knowing how to knock a hammer) However, there are people out there that simply can't program, either because they are not interested or not capable. Perhaps they are good at something else that is not entirely marketable? Is it wrong to be that way?

Being humble is one thing, but not realizing one's gift is another.

Re: Proof you can do hard things

#105

Post by zerop »

Some things which are hard for someone might be easy for someone else. Usually academic things like calculus are seen as hard, but there are many hard things in day to day life, like selling anything to unwilling buyer, handling a rude customer with calm and much more. They too are hard and calculus guys can not do them well.

Re: Proof you can do hard things

#106

Post by tayo42 »

Funny, First semester of calculus I got a C i think, second semester, I failed. I thought about going back to community college and taking a calc class just to see if I can actually pass it. No reason other then that

I suspect I could have passed it with better teaching. I hated that I had to memorize things, which felt tedious, not hard in a good way. If you dont memorize cos,sin,tan stuff you can't take tests fast enough. The class was just how good can you memorize things. I also hated the proofs, pages of proof. No idea why, and the teacher didn't speak english well or communicate well in general

Re: Proof you can do hard things

#108

Post by szundi »

bruce511 wrote: post #102

This resonates a lot with me. At school I coasted, ignored all home work, never studied, and was a consistent C. I was continually told I could fo better by putting in some work (an objective viewpoint I agreed with.) But i had better things to do. I started programming in grade 7, from a book, with a Apple 2 (circa 1982). There were no forums, no Internet just me and a thin booket that came with the computer, plus l…

True when you happened to find just one of the soon best paying new activities. Catching butterflies would have worked out less awesome probably.

Re: Proof you can do hard things

#109

Post by manmal »

smeej wrote: post #47
TheAceOfHearts wrote: post #18

I hate the framing of problems or domains as hard, since it kept me from pursuing them further for many years. And the years later when I tried my hand at those problems, I found that it wasn't nearly as hard as it was being made out to be. Historically many problems have also been hard until people figure them out, and then they stop being considered hard problems. In recent years this has been mostly true of AI-rel…

I hate the framing of problems and domains as hard because I found it so confusing when they turned out to be easy for me. It gave me a false sense of competence and superiority. Because I found calculus (and everything else in school people said was hard) easy, I thought I was just exceptionally capable and other people were incompetent and/or stupid. I didn't find out until much later (and it still feels like much…

For me, being able to do hard things is not something I learned as a kid. It’s a sum of:

- ADHD symptoms being mild,

- Having slept well (ties in with former point), and

- Having no imminent major worries at the moment (family/health/financial).

Any of these can make the difference between casually trying to understand quantum mechanics, and crawling under the table because I just can’t make this one rectangle on the screen do what I want.

Re: Proof you can do hard things

#110

Post by ivansavz »

WesleyJohnson wrote: post #46

I lost interest in school around the 10th or 11th grade. I never took any math classes beyond what was required to graduate way back in '96 in Florida. I also didn't go to college. I've been a professional web developer since 2005 and a development manager (who still codes) since 2017. I don't understand the first thing about Calculus or even logarithms. I'm sure if I did, I'd probably be a better developer. I've had…

> go back to the basics and work my way up; I've lost a lot of it. Where do I start?

You might want to check out my book "No Bullshit Guide to Math & Physics," which starts with a high school math review, and goes up to calculus. It's specifically written for adult learners (self contained + lots of practice exercises).

You can see a PDF preview here https://minireference.com/static/excerpts/noBSmathphys_v5_pr...

The concept map from the book is independently useful to check out: https://minireference.com/static/conceptmaps/math_and_physic... And you should also check out this SymPy tutorial https://minireference.com/static/tutorials/sympy_tutorial.pd... which can help you build a bridge between coding skills and math operations.

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