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Show HN: PFAS.report – Measure the forever chemicals in your blood via Quest

pfas.report

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Re: Show HN: PFAS.report – Measure the forever chemicals in your blood via Quest

#101
post #34

This is interesting, and I suppose has a use of "data over time" but I fail to see how this testing is of any actionable value for the average person. So you're exposed, and PFAS is in EVERYTHING.... so ... what should I do? Nothing realistically. Unless I find an obvious source like my water, there isn't much I can do besides replacing my cooking pans. I can replace my pans without this test. It's a little like thos…

I would also say this attitude was pervasive when we used leaded gasoline, which widely contaminated the biosphere, roads and people. It's everywhere. We all have it. Why bother. I think we now know there's no safe level of lead in the blood. If you have suspected exposure in 2023, doctors quantify your lead level through a blood test and if it's elevated, recommend a medical procedure called chelation to remove it.…

Well, in the case of lead, I don't think it was irrational for individuals to feel disempowered. The solution was regulatory and societal change, but how many people want to devote their lives to being PFAS crusaders?

Re: Show HN: PFAS.report – Measure the forever chemicals in your blood via Quest

#102
post #89

Here's the test on NMS: https://www.nmslabs.com/tests/3427SP NMS does not list consumers as their customers, and none of their customers make medical decisions based on their lab work. NMS claims CLIA certification. This is the older law where labs self-certify compliance. Congress left CLIA in place alongside FDA IVD regulations to protect small pharmacists, but obviously Quest Diagnostics and LabCorp run fleets thr…

Ok, a few thoughts.

Direct to consumer lab testing is offered in ~47 states in the country. It has been available for years with thousands of tests available. To date, there has been no apocalypse from empowering consumers to know about their own personal health.

NMS is one of the preeminent toxicology labs in the country. This test is Liquid chromatography–mass spectrometry which is known, quantifiable, extremely accurate and repeatable test methodology.

National Academies of Science, Engineering and Medicine explicitly references this lab in their report. Further, they go on to elucidate the risks and benefits of offering PFAS testing to people.

"Harms of PFAS testing include fear induced by blood draw, a small risk of injury or infection at the draw site, difficulties in interpreting results, and psychological stress that may occur when people who are tested learn that they or their family members have high levels of PFAS exposure. On the other hand, biomonitoring for PFAS blood levels may also alleviate fears associated with not knowing one’s PFAS levels. Another potential benefit is increasing awareness of exposure so that exposures can be reduced. If sources of exposure are identified, actions taken to reduce these exposures, such as using a water filter, may also benefit family members in addition to the person who was tested. Community-level benefits may be associated with PFAS testing as well, such as empowering communities to respond to contamination and providing a baseline with which to evaluate the impact of community-level interventions to reduce exposure. Additionally, biomonitoring for PFAS in the context of epidemiologic studies could provide more information about PFAS-associated health effects."

Also a couple of quotes from the same paper.

"Kristen Mello of Westfield Residents Advocating for Themselves (WRAFT) said to the committee:

You don’t have a problem getting an insurance assessor when your car is hit, you don’t have a problem getting an insurance assessor when you have a tornado, but this slow motion unfolding environmental and public health disaster … is intentionally keeping the information from us so that we cannot take action.

Furthermore, Emily Donovan of Clean Cape Fear, said:

Sadly it feels like guinea pigs are treated better, because at least their exposures are thoroughly studied for the betterment of humanity.

And Cathy Wusterbarth of Need Our Water said:

We’ve tested the fish; we’ve tested the deer; we’ve tested the groundwater, the waterways, and the foam. When are we going to test the people?… The only risk [of testing] is to the polluters who do not want us to link them to our exposure."

Make what you will.

Source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK584705/

Re: Show HN: PFAS.report – Measure the forever chemicals in your blood via Quest

#104
post #31

I grew up in an area of the Twin Cities metro area of Minnesota that has very high PFAS contamination from decades of 3M's dumping of chemicals. Would love to get one of these tests once available in Minnesota! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3M_Contamination_of_Minnesota_...

I grew up (and still live in) the House Street Disposal Site that has very high PFAS contamination from 3M/Wolverine leather treatment.

There's a whole saga of testing involved:

https://www.michigan.gov/pfasresponse/investigations/sites-a...

https://www.michigan.gov/mdhhs/safety-injury-prev/environmen...

I ended up receiving a few complete blood surveys in the process - comprehensive metabolic panel, hematocrit, cholesterol, testosterone, albumin, bilirubin, thyroid markers, and at least a dozen other medical terms that I don't fully understand, plus what's apparently a more comprehensive PFOA/PFOS study than this one, with dozens of varieties of PFOS/PFOA.

I had a total of 9.8 ug/L in my blood, after drinking water that was 78ppt PFOS for decades.

According to your link, there were tests done by the state in the past, were you unable to participate in those studies?

Re: Show HN: PFAS.report – Measure the forever chemicals in your blood via Quest

#105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Donating blood or plasma has evidence of reducing pfas. If I knew I had high measured levels, I'd certainly think about doing it more. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8994130/

Are you giving someone bad blood in that case?

Well, assuming they likely have some PFAS already in their system, you might just be giving them blood with the same concentration of PFAS that they already have.

Re: Show HN: PFAS.report – Measure the forever chemicals in your blood via Quest

#107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Donating blood or plasma has evidence of reducing pfas. If I knew I had high measured levels, I'd certainly think about doing it more. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8994130/

Are you giving someone bad blood in that case?

Not always, as quite often the donation is on hand, but not necessarily used.

Also: better to save a life and either average down whatever PFA count they have, or bolster their blood volume so they can start producing their own lower PFA infested hemoglobin.

Lesser of evils, and kind of a win win: if everyone was blood letting for the safety and humanity of others.

Re: Show HN: PFAS.report – Measure the forever chemicals in your blood via Quest

#108
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would also say this attitude was pervasive when we used leaded gasoline, which widely contaminated the biosphere, roads and people. It's everywhere. We all have it. Why bother. I think we now know there's no safe level of lead in the blood. If you have suspected exposure in 2023, doctors quantify your lead level through a blood test and if it's elevated, recommend a medical procedure called chelation to remove it.…

Well, in the case of lead, I don't think it was irrational for individuals to feel disempowered. The solution was regulatory and societal change, but how many people want to devote their lives to being PFAS crusaders?

Society is starting to change. EPAs super aggressive new water quality standards. Bans on PFAS in packaging.

PFAS crusader haha.

Edit: forgot the word water

Re: Show HN: PFAS.report – Measure the forever chemicals in your blood via Quest

#109
post #34

This is interesting, and I suppose has a use of "data over time" but I fail to see how this testing is of any actionable value for the average person. So you're exposed, and PFAS is in EVERYTHING.... so ... what should I do? Nothing realistically. Unless I find an obvious source like my water, there isn't much I can do besides replacing my cooking pans. I can replace my pans without this test. It's a little like thos…

I would also say this attitude was pervasive when we used leaded gasoline, which widely contaminated the biosphere, roads and people. It's everywhere. We all have it. Why bother. I think we now know there's no safe level of lead in the blood. If you have suspected exposure in 2023, doctors quantify your lead level through a blood test and if it's elevated, recommend a medical procedure called chelation to remove it.…

Lead in the blood is really just a side effect of chronic exposure. What’s currently considered elevated is something like 3.5 micrograms / dL. It’s equivalent to just a few specks of lead dust in your blood. The bigger issue is that lead in your blood means you have lead in your bones where it will poison you throughout your life.

Re: Show HN: PFAS.report – Measure the forever chemicals in your blood via Quest

#110
post #31

I grew up in an area of the Twin Cities metro area of Minnesota that has very high PFAS contamination from decades of 3M's dumping of chemicals. Would love to get one of these tests once available in Minnesota! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3M_Contamination_of_Minnesota_...

I grew up (and still live in) the House Street Disposal Site that has very high PFAS contamination from 3M/Wolverine leather treatment. There's a whole saga of testing involved: https://www.michigan.gov/pfasresponse/investigations/sites-a... https://www.michigan.gov/mdhhs/safety-injury-prev/environmen... I ended up receiving a few complete blood surveys in the process - comprehensive metabolic panel, hematocrit, chol…

My level is 10.86 ng/mL

Your level was 9.8 ug/mL?

If so thats way way higher. I'm sorry.

Edit: grammer

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