TikTok is now banned in Montana • Hacker News Board

jameshart wrote: post #98

falcolas wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Greg Gianforte's own words, as recorded here: https://www.npr.org/2023/05/18/1176805559/montana-tiktok-ban

Refers to a separate ban - just a gubernatorial directive - that bans TikTok from government devices: > Last December, Gianforte banned TikTok on state government electronic devices. On Wednesday, he added that the ban would expand to include "all social media applications that collect and provide users' personal information or data to a foreign adversary, or a person or entity located within a country designated as…

Hmm. It doesn't identify which ban, a good point.

Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana

#105

Post by mikece » Thu, May 18, 2023, 2:26 PM UTC

Tomorrow's story: "Residents of Montana discover VPNs and how to use them!"

Between Utah and Montana the awareness and use of VPNs is rising among the non-security-conscious, and this is a good thing.

Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana

#106

Post by DubiousPusher » Thu, May 18, 2023, 2:26 PM UTC

1-6 wrote: post #92

Some states are making desperate cries for help while federally, there is little being done. It's good to see the republic still functioning.

This is why the "legislating from the bench" criticism always fell flat for me. America's legislative branch has been deadlocked for 40 years. History abhors a power vacuum. When one exists, the neighboring institutions will bend and stretch to fill it, distorting themselves and the whole power structure in the process.

Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana

#107

Post by falcolas » Thu, May 18, 2023, 2:27 PM UTC

avn2109 wrote: post #99

One underappreciated aspect of this is ban is that anyone who wants Tiktok will just go download it in Wyoming or Idaho etc, as it seems to be merely a ban on downloading the app, and not a ban on Tiktok traffic itself. So the ban will have near zero actual impact in practice (even if it somehow makes it into effect). Furthermore, it's unclear if the web app of Tiktok will be affected, or if it's only a ban on the mo…

Last I heard, there was a "per use" fine for usage as well. Honestly, I haven't looked at this farce of a bill since it was first introduced.

EDIT:

S1: An entity violates this prohibition when any of the following occurs within the territorial jurisdiction of Montana:

(a) the operation of tiktok by the company or users; or

(b) the option to download the tiktok mobile application by a mobile application store.

Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana

#108

Post by mlyle » Thu, May 18, 2023, 2:27 PM UTC

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #91

jameshart wrote: post #88

The actual legislation: https://leg.mt.gov/bills/2023/billpdf/SB0419.pdf Seems facially unconstitutional. Will maybe force a proper court decision on whether the Bills of Attainder clause applies to corporations. Why are legislators so focused on banning TikTok, rather than regulating whatever it is that TikTok does that they don't like? Don't like data about your constituents being in the possession of a company wit…

> Why are legislators so focused on banning TikTok, rather than regulating whatever it is that TikTok does that they don't like There are two issues with TikTok: privacy and national security. The latter is what this is about. (Related to e.g. our foreign media ownership rules.) The federal legislation is trying to create an extensible system for forcing divestiture based on requirements you describe. This is more ha…

There's also the third issue, which is much more problematic to fix with regulation: short-form video is absolutely killing youth attention span. I know students who will ask another student a question, and then lose focus and zone out within literally 3 seconds and not hear the answer. This was not nearly as prevalent a decade ago.

Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana

#109

Post by logicchains » Thu, May 18, 2023, 2:27 PM UTC

edgyquant wrote: post #89

jameshart wrote: post #88

The actual legislation: https://leg.mt.gov/bills/2023/billpdf/SB0419.pdf Seems facially unconstitutional. Will maybe force a proper court decision on whether the Bills of Attainder clause applies to corporations. Why are legislators so focused on banning TikTok, rather than regulating whatever it is that TikTok does that they don't like? Don't like data about your constituents being in the possession of a company wit…

Countries have the right to ban foreign adversaries. US companies are a different problem with different solutions.

>Countries have the right to ban foreign adversaries

This is the same logic that China uses to ban all western apps. Fortunately in the west, countries don't have rights, people do, and citizens generally have the right to run whatever software they want on the hardware devices they own. Governments that violate such rights get challenged in court.

Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana

#110

Post by avn2109 » Thu, May 18, 2023, 2:28 PM UTC

falcolas wrote: post #107

avn2109 wrote: post #99

One underappreciated aspect of this is ban is that anyone who wants Tiktok will just go download it in Wyoming or Idaho etc, as it seems to be merely a ban on downloading the app, and not a ban on Tiktok traffic itself. So the ban will have near zero actual impact in practice (even if it somehow makes it into effect). Furthermore, it's unclear if the web app of Tiktok will be affected, or if it's only a ban on the mo…

Last I heard, there was a "per use" fine for usage as well. Honestly, I haven't looked at this farce of a bill since it was first introduced. EDIT: S1: An entity violates this prohibition when any of the following occurs within the territorial jurisdiction of Montana: (a) the operation of tiktok by the company or users; or (b) the option to download the tiktok mobile application by a mobile application store.

The article claims "...will not impose any penalties on individuals using the app". A commenter elsewhere in this thread links to the law itself, which could presumably disambiguate, though I've not read it.