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Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

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Re: Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

#101
post #50

I am a professional musician (bassoon player in a symphony orchestra). I can, if I practice it a couple of times a week, achieve and sustain perfect pitch. I had no semblance of perfect pitch until I decided to practice it at age 24. Before that the only chance I had to guess a note was to put in in relation to my own voice. Even though I don't practice this anymore (it isn't very useful), I still often just instinct…

I took a music theory class in college that had a very heavy ear-training component.

The TA in the course would often talk about the concept of "pitch memory", both absolute and relative. In other words, perfect pitch isn't a binary concept of you either have it or you don't, but it's your ability to remember and reproduce absolute pitches from memory. What we think of as "perfect pitch" is the extreme version of this, where your pitch memory is basically long-term and you can sing a middle-C on command. But many people have decent short-term pitch memory. One girl in my ear training session (a pretty accomplished cellist) could remember absolute pitches for the whole 1.5 hour session; if we came back to a note, she could get it, but she was usually lost in the beginning of the session when we came in cold. I (9 years of violin training, starting at age 7) had a pitch memory of about 5-10 minutes - while we were working on a specific interval, I could remember and reproduce the base note without being prompted by the piano, but once we moved on to another interval I'd lose it. My wife (no specific music training) goes off-key after about 20 seconds.

It wouldn't surprise me that training this ability when you're young leads to much longer-term memory than training it as an adult, the same way that training gymnastics when young leads to the ability to do a back handspring from muscle memory, or training a foreign language gives you a much better ability to speak it without an accent.

Re: Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

#102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does "epsg:4978" mean?

A longer name for WGS 84.

Sort of but not exactly. The way I'd explain it as someone who's had to deal with a lot but has not been formally trained in it is that WGS 84 is a system for reasoning about the earth spatially. EPSG:4978 and its more commonly used sister EPSG:4326 are standardized ways of writing down coordinates relative to the WGS84 model of the earth.

The "joke" in my comment is that EPSG:4978 coordinates are written down in distance in meters from the center of the earth, as a sort of absolute position that's nice to use in maths. In contrast to EPSG:4326 where coordinates are written down (usually in degrees) relative to the equator and a line through some place in England over an idealized representation of the surface of the earth.

Re: Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

#103
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are tools you can use that will play a note like C and then another note, and you listen and guess what the 2nd note is. It just takes a bit of consistent trial and error learning, after a bit you get the hang of it and kind of create a mapping of what notes sound like in your head. I use a app called Tenuto for it, but I am sure there are others out there.

That would be practising "relative pitch", which is a standard part of ear training. "Perfect pitch" means being able to identify the 2nd note when played by itself, without hearing the 1st note to reference from.

I had an ear training teacher who claimed to have acquired perfect pitch by listening to a tuning fork for 10 minutes a day, and training himself to remember the pitch as a reference. I doubt very much that this worked long-term.

Re: Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

#104
post #50

I am a professional musician (bassoon player in a symphony orchestra). I can, if I practice it a couple of times a week, achieve and sustain perfect pitch. I had no semblance of perfect pitch until I decided to practice it at age 24. Before that the only chance I had to guess a note was to put in in relation to my own voice. Even though I don't practice this anymore (it isn't very useful), I still often just instinct…

May you please explain ELI5 what "perfect pitch" means?

(I was told I was a musical savant, and once I was told that, I was scared away from music... my Violin teacher was known to be owb of the best, SO i dont know what "perfect pitch" is, as I attribute it to 'bad actors'

Re: Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

#105
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolute pitch is just a learned skill like a lot of other things. People learn to identify the pitches because they sound different and learn the names for them. Nerd note: the name "Perfect pitch" is something of a misnomer because the frequencies the note names refer to is a social construct which has changed over time[1]. A=440 is the predominant concert pitch now but since "pitch taste" generally gets brighter/s…

> Absolute pitch is just a learned skill like a lot of other things. Is that true though? I had a friend in college who had perfect pitch. I asked him all the time how he learned it, and he said he didn't know. It just started happening. He never explicitly trained for it. It also wasn't just about notes. He could nearly instantaneously tell chords and keys from the radio or going to the symphony. I would test him us…

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Re: Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

#107
post #50

I am a professional musician (bassoon player in a symphony orchestra). I can, if I practice it a couple of times a week, achieve and sustain perfect pitch. I had no semblance of perfect pitch until I decided to practice it at age 24. Before that the only chance I had to guess a note was to put in in relation to my own voice. Even though I don't practice this anymore (it isn't very useful), I still often just instinct…

May you please explain ELI5 what "perfect pitch" means? (I was told I was a musical savant, and once I was told that, I was scared away from music... my Violin teacher was known to be owb of the best, SO i dont know what "perfect pitch" is, as I attribute it to 'bad actors'

Perfect (or absolute) pitch refers to the ability to distinguish a note (correctly) when you hear it played. Singers with perfect pitch can sing a particular note on command.

If you had perfect pitch, I would be able to play notes on a piano and you would be able to distinguish each. There is a continuum of perfect pitch - some may have perfect pitch after they have warmed up, others may retain their perfect pitch for a short time after they stop playing and others (apparently) always have it. In that aspect, it’s a little like memory.

Mozart and Ella Fitzgerald are two famous people you’ve likely heard who had absolute pitch though I have never read or heard anything that suggests either found it terribly useful. Of the musicians I know who have worked to develop it, it’s mostly kind of a party trick.

If you’re interested in perfect pitch, you should likely learn about relative pitch as well. Whereas perfect pitch refers to the ability to correctly distinguish a note cold, relative pitch refers to the ability to distinguish notes in relation to each other.

Re: Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

#108
post #50

I am a professional musician (bassoon player in a symphony orchestra). I can, if I practice it a couple of times a week, achieve and sustain perfect pitch. I had no semblance of perfect pitch until I decided to practice it at age 24. Before that the only chance I had to guess a note was to put in in relation to my own voice. Even though I don't practice this anymore (it isn't very useful), I still often just instinct…

Could you elaborate on your method? That's quite impressive considering it's widely believed to be untrainable past a certain age (at least that's layman my understanding). Did you start with a complete inability to identify notes, and now are able to identity them immediately (i.e like acquiring a new language?).

The idea that you cannot attain perfect pitch as an adult has been thoroughly debunked. The University of Chicago’s study is most famous but results have been replicated at many other schools. Adults can develop perfect pitch just fine.

The issue seems to be that most adults find it useless and as artists they’re better off spending their time elsewhere.

Re: Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

#109
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does one "practice" perfect pitch? (genuinely asking so I can try it, not trying to make some dumb rhetorical point about it not being possible)

There are tools you can use that will play a note like C and then another note, and you listen and guess what the 2nd note is. It just takes a bit of consistent trial and error learning, after a bit you get the hang of it and kind of create a mapping of what notes sound like in your head. I use a app called Tenuto for it, but I am sure there are others out there.

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Re: Children aged 2-6 successfully trained to acquire absolute pitch (2012)

#110
post #76

Can anybody explain what is so useful about having absolute pitch? And is there a visual equivalent to perfect pitch? E.g. you see a color and you say it's #f3eb20 ? Or you taste a soup and say it's 2 grams of salt on 1L of soup?

Not that helpful. It's a bit akin to being able to tell which individual letters are in a word spoken. It might make some genres of music less enjoyable as they sound too predictable. It does help to play improvisation with other musicians.
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