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The Age of the Crisis of Work

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Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#101

Post by eli_gottlieb »

seydor wrote: post #88

What does money buy? In most of the west not even a home , and luxuries are demonized. Vacations are alright but become a bit of a chore. Work for work's sake does not cut it anymore. Not that this was unexpected, considering the huge demographic shift

Yeah, that's what I think goes unsaid in the article: the shift in cost structure from affordable basics with unattainable luxuries to unattainable basics with routinely affordable "luxuries". It's easy to buy upscale consumer goods (craft beer, video games, leisure equipment, nice clothes) but most people in the Millennial generation and younger are simply not able to own a home.

Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#102

Post by bluefirebrand »

yellowapple wrote: post #96
Gud wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they are providing high value but not reaping high rewards, introspection is warranted.

Then the near-entirety of the American (and global, while we're at it) workforce has quite a bit of introspection to do.

Yeah this was pretty much what I was getting at too.

Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#103

Post by lcnPylGDnU4H9OF »

gdulli wrote: post #95
lcnPylGDnU4H9OF wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putting in effort, especially when it's perceived that the effort goes unrewarded, is stressful. If it's unpredictable how and when I'll be rewarded and it's predictable that I'll be stressed from effort, the calculus is to not be effortful for my own mental health. One might put effort into learning how to do their job better but I would argue that it's folly to put effort into doing everything one's employer tells…

But you have control over your perception. If you tell yourself only futility is possible, yes you'll experience futility. Some amount of stress is something we need to be able to deal with, not avoid altogether. It's not cyanide. There are workplaces toxic enough to be worth leaving, but not giving immediate rewards for doing more than the bare minimum isn't toxicity. At a certain point, if you need a salary and ben…

For what it's worth, I oversimplified. The calculus is not so simple as that but that certainly goes into it (I believe to your point: "There are workplaces toxic enough to be worth leaving"). If I need to work extra hard to distinguish myself for a hope at receiving some benevolence -- simply being able to keep my job is considered benevolence in this case -- I'll understand that I am in a workplace that is toxic enough to be worth leaving.

Not being laid-off is still a hope which doesn't do anything to alleviate the unpredictability of a return for my effort. But I can make my own return. I will do my job well enough that I can tell someone with a straight face that I can do what they need me to do. I can predict that return. That is my security for the potential that I need to find a new job.

Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#104

Post by CodeSgt »

gdulli wrote: post #85
adamwong246 wrote: post #72

A lot of people are realizing it just doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if you are great or terrible at your job, because you might get fired or laid-off either way. You can spend you whole life squirreling away your retirement, only to watch those savings evaporate at the next "financial crisis". We're told the system is meritocracy but it never seems to pan out that way.

I really this attitude is too dire. Effort is not always rewarded quickly or transactionally. But over the long run, it does make a difference. Even if there's more bullshit and frustration than there should be along the way.

Agreed. It may not be a perfect meritocracy, but over the course of a life a little effort and competence go a long way.

Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#105

Post by yifanl »

nine_zeros wrote: post #86
blastro wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think he's saying that you will continue to get paid and be part of the team. That's the trade. The others are on their way out, slowly or quickly. Not that there's some extra benefit by being on the A side.

> I think he's saying that you will continue to get paid and be part of the team. That's the trade. The others are on their way out, slowly or quickly. Not that there's some extra benefit by being on the A side. And why does he think that A employees will continue to be around if this is the game?

I assume the quiet part is "they won't have a choice not to because everybody is playing the same game"

Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#106

Post by ipaddr »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #78
ipaddr wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm glad I can help make him money. No fuss and some pride. It makes my position more solid.

> It makes my position more solid This is increasingly less true though. People are seeing that they can produce high value for years and never get rewarded, and eventually get laid off when cuts need to happen. At that point, why try?

Reward is company staying afloat and I keep getting paid. If company is growing I get managing opportunities.

Ever work at a failing company? That's a worse tradeoff.

Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#107

Post by AnimalMuppet »

gdulli wrote: post #85
adamwong246 wrote: post #72

A lot of people are realizing it just doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if you are great or terrible at your job, because you might get fired or laid-off either way. You can spend you whole life squirreling away your retirement, only to watch those savings evaporate at the next "financial crisis". We're told the system is meritocracy but it never seems to pan out that way.

I really this attitude is too dire. Effort is not always rewarded quickly or transactionally. But over the long run, it does make a difference. Even if there's more bullshit and frustration than there should be along the way.

Over the long run, effort is quite often rewarded more than lack of effort. Not perfectly. But often enough that it's the way to bet.

Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#108

Post by kyleyeats »

tester457 wrote: post #90
kyleyeats wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's easy: You're pre-selected. You've been trained for decades in one way or another to unquestioningly chase the mission . You went through five interviews and putting mission-over-self was the #1 selection criterion in each. You call it imposter syndrome or cPTSD or ADHD but the truth is you've just had people screaming expectations in your ear your whole life. It's not a question of you vs. your employer but of y…

So what does it mean to pick you in this situation?

In the short term, you get a pretty-much-objectively-better employee. In the long term, hiring too many of this type of employee hurts the company culture in a way similar to the CEO being surrounded by "Yes" men. It creates a paralyzed indecision culture of over-engineering. The binge-and-purge nature of tech is to reach this state and then do massive layoffs to address it.

Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#109

Post by denkmoon »

gdulli wrote: post #87
denkmoon wrote: post #38

Why the fuck would I ever put in more effort than absolutely necessary when I will not be rewarded proportionately for the increased effort? It probably won't even be noticed. and even if I were, where does that get me? Still sucking eggs in a housing market that is now more than ever before for business rather than for fulfilling a human need, still suffering through the bureaucratic uncaring nightmare that is the s…

> Why the fuck would I ever put in more effort than absolutely necessary when I will not be rewarded proportionately for the increased effort? Because it's unpredictable how and when you'll be rewarded, so why not put yourself in a position to capitalize when you can?

If I'm a good dog they sometimes throw me a bone.

Re: The Age of the Crisis of Work

#110

Post by pydry »

CodeSgt wrote: post #104
gdulli wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really this attitude is too dire. Effort is not always rewarded quickly or transactionally. But over the long run, it does make a difference. Even if there's more bullshit and frustration than there should be along the way.

Agreed. It may not be a perfect meritocracy, but over the course of a life a little effort and competence go a long way.

Not as far as it used to though.

Economic rents are taking a larger % of western economies every year.

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