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Electricity Prices by Country

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Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#101

Post by TheLoafOfBread »

cbmuser wrote: post #96
tfourb wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think I provided any judgement whatsoever, I just described how it works and the effects it had in this specific situation. Both are correct as I described them, to the best of my knowledge. If you are interested in my opinion, I'm perfectly willing to accept that this kind of auction system works efficiently and effectively under normal circumstances. But in this specific scenario, it led to consumer prices…

The problem aren’t the gas plants, the problem is the insufficient amount of cheap electricity on the market. Wind and PV heavily rely on backup power plants. So building a lot of wind and PV increases the reliance on gas plants instead of reducing it. Even the government’s own energy agency "DENA" makes this claim. See: https://www.dena.de/fileadmin/dena/Dokumente/Pdf/9262_dena-L... (p. 28f).

It is a paradox. The more renewables you will build, the more dependent on fossil fuels you will become.

Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#102

Post by tfourb »

carlosjobim wrote: post #88
tfourb wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if you are a connoisseur of conspiracy theories, this comment is bullshit. The pipelines in question actually did not carry any natural gas at the time of the explosion. Both pipelines of Nord Stream 1 were destroyed but deliveries by Russia had been stopped well before that in retaliation to German/EU sanctions. One of the two pipelines of Nord Stream 2 was destroyed, but that project was never activated, due t…

> conspiracy theories What? The pipeline didn't blow up by itself, so some party had to conspire to blow it up.

There is currently no evidence whatsoever that the US was involved in the attack on the pipeline in any way. To the best of my knowledge, the current best lead is a group of allegedly Ukrainian nationals who hired a private boat and were in the area where the explosions happened during the time in question. Ukraine is denying any involvement (of course) and the people in question have not been apprehended. The only reasoning that currently points to the US is that they would have the technical capabilities and a motive, but that applies to dozens of actors, including Russia.

Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#103

Post by tfourb »

TheLoafOfBread wrote: post #101
cbmuser wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem aren’t the gas plants, the problem is the insufficient amount of cheap electricity on the market. Wind and PV heavily rely on backup power plants. So building a lot of wind and PV increases the reliance on gas plants instead of reducing it. Even the government’s own energy agency "DENA" makes this claim. See: https://www.dena.de/fileadmin/dena/Dokumente/Pdf/9262_dena-L... (p. 28f).

It is a paradox. The more renewables you will build, the more dependent on fossil fuels you will become.

Up to a point. Long term the idea is to get rid of fossil fuels entirely and there are good indications that this is achievable.

Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#104

Post by wand3r »

> Venezuela - $0.00?

It doesn't really expand on this either. It only says they have tons of natural energy resources. So when they say 0, do they just mean average people just dont have to pay?

Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#105

Post by rippercushions »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #100
perardi wrote: post #84

One little thing that stuck out: The USA leads the way in terms of household electric usage in the world – an average US household consumes approximately 975 kilowatt-hours of electricity each month, three times more than for example the United Kingdom. Which got me wondering how big US domiciles are versus those in the UK. Turns out: lot of big-ass houses here in the US. https://shrinkthatfootprint.com/how-big-is-a-…

I am curious about quintile statistics, or at least median. Domiciles are definitely bigger in the US, but I bet the mean average is dragged way up by the top 20% of houses. Air conditioning also uses the most electricity in a house, and the US has a lot more populated hot and humid regions than many European countries.

Nope, electric heating uses much more power than air conditioning.

Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#106

Post by tfourb »

cbmuser wrote: post #96
tfourb wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think I provided any judgement whatsoever, I just described how it works and the effects it had in this specific situation. Both are correct as I described them, to the best of my knowledge. If you are interested in my opinion, I'm perfectly willing to accept that this kind of auction system works efficiently and effectively under normal circumstances. But in this specific scenario, it led to consumer prices…

The problem aren’t the gas plants, the problem is the insufficient amount of cheap electricity on the market. Wind and PV heavily rely on backup power plants. So building a lot of wind and PV increases the reliance on gas plants instead of reducing it. Even the government’s own energy agency "DENA" makes this claim. See: https://www.dena.de/fileadmin/dena/Dokumente/Pdf/9262_dena-L... (p. 28f).

The German government relied heavily on the theory that gas power plants could facilitate the turn to renewable energies. In and off itself this was not a bad idea. But combined with getting 50% of all natural gas imports from a single (hostile) country it was a terrible decision.

Diversifying natural gas imports and having more long-term contracts with other producers would have been slightly more expensive before the Ukraine war, but it would have drastically reduced the price jumps thereafter.

Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#107

Post by kwhitefoot »

perardi wrote: post #84

One little thing that stuck out: The USA leads the way in terms of household electric usage in the world – an average US household consumes approximately 975 kilowatt-hours of electricity each month, three times more than for example the United Kingdom. Which got me wondering how big US domiciles are versus those in the UK. Turns out: lot of big-ass houses here in the US. https://shrinkthatfootprint.com/how-big-is-a-…

Hardly any airconditioned houses in the UK and heating is mostly by gas. I expect that accounts for quite a lot of it.

Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#108

Post by lotsofpulp »

rippercushions wrote: post #105
lotsofpulp wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am curious about quintile statistics, or at least median. Domiciles are definitely bigger in the US, but I bet the mean average is dragged way up by the top 20% of houses. Air conditioning also uses the most electricity in a house, and the US has a lot more populated hot and humid regions than many European countries.

Nope, electric heating uses much more power than air conditioning.

I guess that is true, I just imagined so few domiciles actually use electric heating, or use electric heating in places that do not get really cold, that it is not a significant factor in national statistics of electricity usage.

Seems like 40% of US households use electric heating though, which is way more than I expected.

https://www.census.gov/acs/www/about/why-we-ask-each-questio...

Edit: fixed link

Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#109

Post by jenadine »

this_user wrote: post #64
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just any coal, but lignite, the nastiest, dirtiest kind of coal. Definitely greener than nuclear. /s

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3b/En...

Imagine if they had been growing the nuclear instead of reducing it, it would have allowed to almost get rid of lignite and coal. Instead it is still a portion. (And solar and wind being intermittent you can't just have that)

Re: Electricity Prices by Country

#110

Post by tzs »

perardi wrote: post #84

One little thing that stuck out: The USA leads the way in terms of household electric usage in the world – an average US household consumes approximately 975 kilowatt-hours of electricity each month, three times more than for example the United Kingdom. Which got me wondering how big US domiciles are versus those in the UK. Turns out: lot of big-ass houses here in the US. https://shrinkthatfootprint.com/how-big-is-a-…

I'd guess that a far bigger factor is that the US has a much higher percentage of houses the use electricity for room heating.

I believe that it is similar for water heating.

In the US there is also a high percentage of houses that use electricity for the stoves and oven and for clothes drying. A brief didn't turn up how much electricity is used for those things in the UK, but if it is like much of the rest of Europe I'd not be surprised if it is lower than in the US.

In the US around 26% of houses use electricity as their only energy source, compared to around 9% for the UK.

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