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How Equifax Became a Private IRS

mattstoller.substack.com

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Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#101

Post by runnerup »

MerelyMortal wrote: post #13
mbg721 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems weird not to name Experian. Aren't there only three?

There are a bunch of other types of reporting agencies too, not just for credit: https://www.consumerlawfirm.com/credit-reporting-agencies.ht... https://www.consumerfinance.gov/consumer-tools/credit-report...

Yeah I've had difficulty renting apartments for 8 years because "LeasingDesk" falsely reported that I owed a past landlord $36,000. No one ever told me this is why my applications always faced long delays, additional scrutiny, increasingly insane documentation requirements, and huge security deposits.

Finally I asked my most recent apartment complex "WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON?" and they were like "uhh this report..." and I spent 3 months getting LeasingDesk to deny, deny, and finally admit/accept my claim that they had bad data.

It was a nightmare to get it fixed. They just said "No, the data is correct because we called your old apartment complex and they said it was correct." Because LeasingDesk was acting in good faith I could only sue my old apartment complex for misreporting it, I couldn't use CFPB to force LeasingDesk to fix it.

So yeah, its not just Experian/TransUnion/Equifax....there are dozens and dozens and dozens of data brokers acting as credit bureaus. Right now the only protections consumers have from them come from the CFPB but if that's ever abolished we'll only have lawyers and torts.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#102

Post by landemva »

hnburnsy wrote: post #82

you can view, dispute, and opt out of your salary info here... https://employees.theworknumber.com/employee-data-freeze

Opt out ... maybe, until the next website hack.

I recently interviewed and got job offer contingent on verifying work history, etc. After I cleared that, the link for docusign arrived. I called the recruiter and asked about payroll data sharing. She claimed to have never heard of it. A day later she said they don't do that. I explained my concerns, said I won't work for a company that does not respect employee privacy, and to go ask finance and HR. Just over a week later she confirmed they don't do that and she detailed exactly what is shared and when - State new hire DB, payroll taxes, medical plan, and by court order. I thanked her and signed the agreement to work for them.

We only have a choice if we are willing to use it.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#103

Post by xwolfi »

kornhole wrote: post #50

Since I can't opt out of this and all the scoundrels can see it anyway, I think I should just post my salary on my Linkedin page. If everybody did that, it would undercut this business and bring to light the inequities to the common people.

You underestimate dishonesty in the population: having your pay exposed may force your company to reduce it to the lowest common denominator to avoid all the cries by people who simply shouldnt be paid like you (age, experience, output, knowledge criticality, all these things people dont wanna hear)

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#104

Post by mindslight »

coderintherye wrote: post #26

One thing Matt mentions but doesn't go into is how this could (should?) be a government service. In fact, there is the IRS's IVES program: https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/inco... but it is already fairly antiquated. There's a great opportunity here for the IRS to provide this service (with revenue from charging the requesting entities), with citizens being self-sovereign over what data is shar…

Or rather than further entrenching the idea, we could work towards effective privacy legislation and relegate all of these commercial surveillance databases to the dustbin of history.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#105

Post by mindslight »

refurb wrote: post #43
coderintherye wrote: post #26

One thing Matt mentions but doesn't go into is how this could (should?) be a government service. In fact, there is the IRS's IVES program: https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/inco... but it is already fairly antiquated. There's a great opportunity here for the IRS to provide this service (with revenue from charging the requesting entities), with citizens being self-sovereign over what data is shar…

There is no free lunch. Limiting credit checks to AGI just means everyone will assumed to have an unknown credit history and will have much higher rates. You ready to get a mortgage at prime plus 5% instead of prime plus 1%? But let me guess, we could create a law about that? Having the government do things doesn’t magically mean market forces don’t apply any more.

> You ready to get a mortgage at prime plus 5% instead of prime plus 1%?

So then homes would become more affordable, as monthly payments are the limiting factor? Sounds like a win-win, if that actually were to happen. But it seems unlikely for secured credit.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#106

Post by aidenn0 »

MerelyMortal wrote: post #13
mbg721 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems weird not to name Experian. Aren't there only three?

There are a bunch of other types of reporting agencies too, not just for credit: https://www.consumerlawfirm.com/credit-reporting-agencies.ht... https://www.consumerfinance.gov/consumer-tools/credit-report...

And before that large companies would keep their own records. My dad needed to put down a 3-figure deposit for his first phone line in the 70s because someone with the same first name and last name who lived in the same town as he went to college regularly racked up over $100 per month in long-distance bills.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#107

Post by kornhole »

xwolfi wrote: post #103
kornhole wrote: post #50

Since I can't opt out of this and all the scoundrels can see it anyway, I think I should just post my salary on my Linkedin page. If everybody did that, it would undercut this business and bring to light the inequities to the common people.

You underestimate dishonesty in the population: having your pay exposed may force your company to reduce it to the lowest common denominator to avoid all the cries by people who simply shouldnt be paid like you (age, experience, output, knowledge criticality, all these things people dont wanna hear)

I would love to see how it plays out. It will be more difficult to lower my pay than it will be to raise others.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#108

Post by TheDong »

gruez wrote: post #73
TheDong wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My parents taught me that debt was bad. They told me that credit cards were traps to get you into debt, that preyed on poor impulse control, and that it was better not to have one. If you can't tell, my parents grew up in a time when the credit score system didn't really matter, and didn't understand it. I did not get a credit card. I did not have any loans, for school or anything else. My credit score wasn't even a…

>My credit score wasn't even a number, it just didn't exist. Even the bank I banked with, which could see that I had more than $8k USD deposited monthly, that could see I had $30k in an account with them, would not give me a loan to buy a car. Right, because it's a credit score, not a finance score. I'm not sure what you want here. Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life…

> Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life so they can have a more accurate picture?

I mean, if instead it was the government, and they could also draw information about my salary, yeah, that sounds kinda nice. Not having to own a credit card to prove that I exist to a landlord does seems pretty good to me.

But my overall point here is that a credit score is not as simple as the above poster made it sound. Someone who's been financially responsible can still run into issues because of this weird system leaking into so many places.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#109

Post by consp »

atdrummond wrote: post #37
xxpor wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see where you're coming from, but on the other hand, the biggest rules are well known and quite simple: If you take a loan and pay it back on time, you'll have high credit. If you fail to meet your obligations, you won't. The existence of an underclass which is constantly on the edge of not being able to pay their bills is true though.

My credit is tanked from an ex opening up accounts in my name and running up the tab while I was being treated for leukaemia and Crohns. Six years later and I’m still fixing the damage.

Question from someone not in the us: can you legally open a creditcard in someone else's name or does it have to involve some form of fraud?

I'm pretty sure my application was only valid when signed by the requester by that was in Europe and rules may differ. I do know you can open them for shared accounts, but that is not what I am talking about.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#110

Post by TheDong »

wmf wrote: post #100
gruez wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>My credit score wasn't even a number, it just didn't exist. Even the bank I banked with, which could see that I had more than $8k USD deposited monthly, that could see I had $30k in an account with them, would not give me a loan to buy a car. Right, because it's a credit score, not a finance score. I'm not sure what you want here. Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life…

I see this as an education problem. People need to be taught the specific rules of credit scores in addition to general personal finance.

I feel like my parent's point about credit cards and college loans being bad were correct though.

Like, I believe they're right that going to college on a full-ride scholarship was better than going to a more expensive one on a loan.

I also believe they're right that credit cards are bad. Like, banks make money on credit cards by: 1. hoping you miss a payment, and collecting interest, and 2. charging merchants, thus raising the price of goods for everyone (typically)

I guess you're saying that we should teach people "Yes, use credit cards, these tools designed to put you in debt, but be careful. Why use something designed to put you in debt? Because there's another private company that will punish you by not letting you rent certain apartments if you don't use a credit card"

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