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A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

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Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#101

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

maxbond wrote: post #82
A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, thank you for your answers. Some disclosure may be necessary. I am a strong free speech proponent, which colors my views of the world somewhat. I will admit that in this case, I had no real objection, but I was more trying to understand how you see the world and to what extent some things are ok ( which you correctly identified anyway ). In other words, I found your post interesting and decided to engage. Beli…

I appreciate your engaging, and doing so respectfully and open mindedly. I never took the impression you were unreasonable or that our dialogue would be unproductive. I do think you're mistaking a mistake that I see many free speech advocates make, which is to confuse criticism with compelled speech or compelled silence. A critical benefit of free speech is to make an argument that something is bad, including even th…

No worries. I never got that impression either. Your interpretation and argument is reasonable. As you noted, my concerns hover around compelled speech/silence ( and issues surrounding it ). At this time, I think I accept your argument as presented.

Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#102

Post by kayodelycaon »

Mezzie wrote: post #91
lanyard-textile wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TW, possible depictions of loving families & depictions of unwanted contact: Nobody should be arguing against any kind of trigger warning in those spaces. If someone is pushing back, they should be removed from the space -- They're actively working against the point of the space. >Which nobody is ever going to warn for. I will now in those kinds of spaces. Anecdotally I've also seen trigger warnings for father's day…

I appreciate that, but I don't think it's necessary. It's more a commentary on the fact that trigger warnings are so varied and personal that accurately making them for all of us PTSD sufferers puts a huge mental burden on people. Sometimes, that's appropriate - I have no problem asking my friends, remaining family members, or therapist/other medical providers to accommodate my desires, but I think asking strangers o…

I think that the people in the middle don’t stand out. I’m in a group of writers. None of us are jerks about “trigger warnings”. We just put some obvious content warnings (rape, suicide, etc) before the main text and call it a day.

You’ll never be able to put in every trigger. For example, angry drunk people. I’d never expect anyone to warn me about that in any form of media. (Goodfellas is awesome, btw)

There is a reasonable middle ground here. A short list of the most common issues better than nothing while not being onerous. Is mentioning your story includes a graphic depiction of rape difficult? I had a rather frank discussion with a fellow author who gave me that one without warning me.

Obviously the most vocal will never be happy. They can go hug a cactus.

Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#103

Post by SanjayMehta »

wpietri wrote: post #21
civilized wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine the things people consider NSFL depend on their personality and background. These studies seem like they'd be more illuminating if they looked at e.g. rape content warnings for rape survivors. Effects on the rest of us matter as well, but shouldn't be considered the whole story.

Exactly. If I'm going to warn people about content, it's because of what those specific people might struggle with. It was something I understood better once I found a piece of pretty ordinary media traumatic. And here I should say: content warning for cancer and death. Some years back my mom was getting treated for a brain tumor. It was a glioblastoma, and as one of her surgeons explained, "This is the thing you wil…

I genuinely feel your pain. Went through the same experience with my father. Multiple myeloma. 18 months.

Strangely enough it left me immune to images and videos of human suffering, and they now have no effect on me at all.

But I can't deal with anything to do with animals in pain or suffering.

I wonder if it's something to do with communication. He would communicate what was happening very clearly and was very rational about his wishes.

Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#104

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

kosievdmerwe wrote: post #39
A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a fascinating concept to me. How granular should we get? Say.. in original Star Wars, should we add "Contains scenes of hand mutilation" or "Character may discover he is not, in fact, a child of a loving parental unit"? I get what you are getting at, but I am curious how much of that profile should be fleshed out in your view?

So, interestingly IMDb has a pretty detailed parents guide. For example for Shrek: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0126029/parentalguide

Ok. I had no idea IMDb keeps notes like this. I dutifully checked Star Wars and hand is indeed mentioned[1]. Thank you!

[1]https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0086190/parentalguide?ref_=tt_s...

Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#105

Post by wpietri »

dmix wrote: post #83
wpietri wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure. I think it's something we have to figure out jointly between people of different experiences. But I agree with others that definitionally the effectiveness for less common stuff can't be measured by looking at the general-audience reaction.

If you were a university or journalist or public figure tweeting etc, it's important to consider the generic utility. Your example is very relevant as it's both very real and also extremely specific to your own world and context. Trying to predict every potential 'trigger' imposes a major mental burden both on the authors/editors to find them and on the reader in the distracting way it's prominently appended to infor…

I don't think one should let consideration drive paralysis. But I don't think devoting a modest amount of time to being considerate is wasteful.

That said, I think there are plenty of people who feel resentful that people are now asking them to be considerate when before they could get away with being thoughtless jerks. That's especially the case when the requests for consideration come from groups constructed as lesser (women, non-dominant ethnic groups, gender/sexuality minorities, etc). Those people can go fly a kite.

I disagree that the costs are growing. My experience is that I spend an approximately constant amount of time on consideration. On occasion, somebody points out how something I said could be unpleasant or harmful to some set of people. I think about it, usually find another way to make my point, and move on. From what I've seen, the only people who find this burdensome are the ones who are resentful that they have to think about people unlike them, and so don't end up learning. That's a choice that they can make, but I don't see any reason to coddle them.

Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#106

Post by wpietri »

SanjayMehta wrote: post #103
wpietri wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. If I'm going to warn people about content, it's because of what those specific people might struggle with. It was something I understood better once I found a piece of pretty ordinary media traumatic. And here I should say: content warning for cancer and death. Some years back my mom was getting treated for a brain tumor. It was a glioblastoma, and as one of her surgeons explained, "This is the thing you wil…

I genuinely feel your pain. Went through the same experience with my father. Multiple myeloma. 18 months. Strangely enough it left me immune to images and videos of human suffering, and they now have no effect on me at all. But I can't deal with anything to do with animals in pain or suffering. I wonder if it's something to do with communication. He would communicate what was happening very clearly and was very ratio…

My sympathies. I know the effect you mean. I have probably made it through the worst experience in my life, so a lot of things below that threshold just don't touch me in the same way.

I'm glad you had that much time with him and that his mind was unclouded. Even now, years later, I treasure those moments of presence.

Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#107

Post by dmix »

wpietri wrote: post #105
dmix wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you were a university or journalist or public figure tweeting etc, it's important to consider the generic utility. Your example is very relevant as it's both very real and also extremely specific to your own world and context. Trying to predict every potential 'trigger' imposes a major mental burden both on the authors/editors to find them and on the reader in the distracting way it's prominently appended to infor…

I don't think one should let consideration drive paralysis. But I don't think devoting a modest amount of time to being considerate is wasteful. That said, I think there are plenty of people who feel resentful that people are now asking them to be considerate when before they could get away with being thoughtless jerks. That's especially the case when the requests for consideration come from groups constructed as les…

> Those people can go fly a kite.

> From what I've seen, the only people who find this burdensome are the ones who are resentful that they have to think about people unlike them

This sort of smug/stereotypical dismissal of why people don't care to add preambles to every comment/paragraph they write or say aloud that might offend or upset someone is exactly why people push back on this sort of thing.

Ignore all counterpoints and just accuse them all of not caring about x victim's predicament. Surely that will convince them.

Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#108

Post by kuramitropolis »

A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #19
all2well wrote: post #10

What about stuff like movie and game ratings? What about things like restricting sexually explicit material to minors? Seems like a weird point to make. What I like about content warnings is that I can choose whether I want to engage with something that might upset me in a more granular fashion than “entire profile.” It’s not like I’d stop avoiding content if there were no CWs anywhere.

This is a fascinating concept to me. How granular should we get? Say.. in original Star Wars, should we add "Contains scenes of hand mutilation" or "Character may discover he is not, in fact, a child of a loving parental unit"? I get what you are getting at, but I am curious how much of that profile should be fleshed out in your view?

Each piece of content's full semantic structure (think https://xkcd.com/657/ but 10x-1000x more elaborate) should be published in a machine-readable format; then in your personal content blocker you can define as elaborate a filter as needed.

Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#109

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

dang wrote: post #99
A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Please don't take HN threads further into ideological flamewar. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. In addition, please edit out swipes (like "calm down"), and don't cross into personal attack. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

I apologize for that. I can no longer edit the stuff, but I can promise I will slow things down a little before pressing reply next time around.

Re: A meta-analysis of the effects of trigger warnings and content notes

#110

Post by PuppyTailWags »

catiopatio wrote: post #88
kayodelycaon wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I definitely use content warnings to avoid stuff. If I see suicide, "that's a nope from me dawg". I feel like I'm not asking for much here. :(

Lots of overly fragile people have hang-ups, and lots more will claim them — or wallow in them — if there’s an advantage to do so, and even if that advantage is merely a boost to their ego: you’re special, you’re unique, your problems and inability to control them are not a failing, but a genuine disability society should accommodate. We can’t possibly account for every possible form of extreme emotional fragility, n…

Hey, you sound like people haven't been very kind to you, and have taught you their cruelty is normal. I just want to say I'm sorry and I hope you find someone who can teach you that people can genuinely care about your wellbeing and do things that they know increase your quality of life, such as avoiding topics that they know make you uncomfortable.

I hope you find someone that teaches you that kindness doesn't have to be conditional.

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