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Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

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101–110 of 349 posts

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#101
This will absolutely not work, I have FSD and it messes up distance of large well defined objects, think about how this will work with a concrete wall, or curbs that it can probably no longer see.

When I pull into my garage sometimes it recognizes my shelf as a car ON FSD....

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#102
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There are multiple tells that this move, just like the removal of radar, is supply-chain and cost-driven and not actually driven by engineering. Not true. Elon Musk has long maintained that cameras/vision is all that is needed [1]. After all, that's all a human has. [1] https://techcrunch.com/2019/04/22/anyone-relying-on-lidar-is...

> After all, that's all a human has. As a human that has only eyes, I've smashed the underside of my front bumper on many a curb over the years in various cars because just sight alone, blocked by the hood and front end of a car is a crappy way of judging things like that. I say this as someone who absolutely loves his Model3.. but a step back is a step back, no matter how one spins it. Radar-delete was a user experi…

Absolutely agree. I think all self-driving cars should be required to have LiDARs.

I was just reporting what Musk said:

"Elon Musk reportedly demanded cameras over radar in self-driving cars because human eyes don't rely on radar" [1].

Are the down-votes intended for Musk?

[1] https://www.businessinsider.in/tech/news/elon-musk-reportedl...

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#103
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With the removal of radar, they showed some pretty convincing data that the radar was too noisy to be useful, especially with discriminating things like highway overpasses vs. stopped cars. They showed that vision could already outperform radar. With these parking sensors it's different. They have no current alternative and it will cause a pretty significant loss of functionality. Disappointing move.

I'd love to see the convincing data RE: radar - they're using the same radars as every other car that has emergency braking from the car in front of the car that's in front of you. I've not heard of many "phantom braking" sessions from these other vehicles - I may have missed something.

I got a ton of phantom braking just two weeks ago when I rented a 2020 Toyota Corolla with this feature. I've also gotten it in a 2019 Tesla Model 3, of course.

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

High-end as defined by what besides price? Not necessarily snark, I haven't heard too much good about fit and finish...

People who have never driven a car worth more than $50,000 love the luxury feel of their Teslas. It's been really interesting to see how many people had a Tesla as their first expensive car.

As a person who’s owned some luxury cars in their life, going from a BMW to a Model3 feels like a really big downgrade in so many ways.

I can give a list of reasons why I didn’t buy an M3P at the time but quality, lack of repair options and really shitty interior topped the list.

Not having carplay/android auto or satellite radio were minor but still annoying in a car that cost so much money.

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#105
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if you're head and shoulders above any of your competitors, you're able to get away with things like this. The hubris of Tesla is still believing this to be the case. I personally cancelled my cybertruck order from lack of interest. better competition exists in 2022 that wasn’t the case years ago.

Tesla's are outselling every other manufacturer (ICE or otherwise) in many countries for the last quarter and they are still severely supply constrained; your personal antidotal data point doesn't serve much purpose in the broader context.

Let's look at EVs in Europe:

https://eu-evs.com/marketShare/ALL/Groups/Line/All-time-by-Y...

Tesla was the number 1 EV maker in 2019, but so far in 2022 Tesla is number 3.

Other manufacturers own many brands and release many models under each brand. The Tesla Model Y is the best selling EV in Norway this year:

https://elbilstatistikk.no/

But the best selling EV manufacturer in Norway is Volkswagen. Volkswagen has four EVs in Norway's top 10 sellers: VW ID.4, Skoda Enyaq, Audi Q4 e-tron, and the Audi e-tron.

The VW ID.4, Skoda Enyaq, and the Audi Q4 e-tron are different versions of the same car. Rather than selling just one model Volkswagen's approach gives you the choice of more options.

Add in ICE vehicles and it's not even close. Volkswagen sells 10 million per year globally across all of its brands (VW, SEAT, Cupra, Skoda, Audi, Porsche, Lamborghini, Bentley, Ducati, Scania, MAN, etc.).

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#106
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd love to see the convincing data RE: radar - they're using the same radars as every other car that has emergency braking from the car in front of the car that's in front of you. I've not heard of many "phantom braking" sessions from these other vehicles - I may have missed something.

They were using the radar for lane guidance. That's why they had to have a whitelist of locations where the radar was false triggered by the roadside environment. It never actually worked properly and they just papered it over with a hack to temporarily blind their input.

Radar for lane guidance? Uh, are you sure?

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#107
post #22

There are multiple tells that this move, just like the removal of radar, is supply-chain and cost-driven and not actually driven by engineering. If this were a planned move, the software would already be ready to replace it. It is not. Cars without radar still aren't at parity with the car that have it, although they "fixed" this a few weeks back by simply turning off the radar on the older cars. The parking sensors…

It looks like they are transparently trying to raise their margins. I guess they are more supply-constrained than they thought. The "smart car of the future" from Tesla now has no sensors other than cameras, and not very many of those.

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> After all, that's all a human has. As a human that has only eyes, I've smashed the underside of my front bumper on many a curb over the years in various cars because just sight alone, blocked by the hood and front end of a car is a crappy way of judging things like that. I say this as someone who absolutely loves his Model3.. but a step back is a step back, no matter how one spins it. Radar-delete was a user experi…

Absolutely agree. I think all self-driving cars should be required to have LiDARs. I was just reporting what Musk said: "Elon Musk reportedly demanded cameras over radar in self-driving cars because human eyes don't rely on radar" [1]. Are the down-votes intended for Musk? [1] https://www.businessinsider.in/tech/news/elon-musk-reportedl...

Your wording, especially the "Not true" puts it in your own voice.

Not to mention, just repeating Musk's statement in the context you did (as a response to someone explicitly disagreeing already) implies that you agree with it.

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#109
post #76
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I drove a new M3 in Germany last week and was blown away by how well the assisted driving features worked. Below 60 kmh it also allows you to never touch the steering wheel while on the highway in a traffic jam. For my purposes it seemed superior to the current Tesla system and after watching some comparison videos, my conclusion seemed accurate.

In your sentence are you referring to a BMW M3? Since Tesla also have an M3 (edit: albeit abbreviated) I was a tad confused by your second paragraph

WXLCKNO is referring to the BMW M3, specifically the "BMW Traffic Jam Assistant".

Re: Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision

#110
As an engineer, I see little value in removing any sensors. No matter how noisy or limited they are, they bring additional information which, if processed, could improve overall accuracy. This is commonly referred to as "sensor fusion". So this is probably is purely cost-saving move. While I understand how radar could be expensive, I am not sure the saving on much cheaper ultrasound sensors is worth the loss of additional information about the environment.

As Telsa Model 3 owner, I can attest that their automatic parking rarely works anyway. They should be adding more sensors to improve it, not remove them.

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