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Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

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Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#101

Post by sumtechguy »

jhickok wrote: post #46
Xylakant wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most windows laptops today come with a license key baked into the BIOS. So no need to manage licenses here.

I do not believe those are sufficient for enterprise licenses, which must be provided separately.

I was looking at a quarter million for a few dozen machines and 2 AD servers and 4 SQL servers. Nearly on par with the cost of the hardware I was buying. Until some bright spark realized it was all testing/dev/qa for those machines, MSDN suddenly was way better cost wise. If all you are doing is testing/dev then MSDN is usually the choice you want (but grab your lawyer to dig into the terms on that one). But in a real env with no dev work, the licenses become a real pain and very costly, and per year recurring many times, and stack because each service type has time, or sometimes they combine. Not dealing with it at all is very tempting.

Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#102

Post by chrisan »

politelemon wrote: post #54

> Due to Microsoft Windows' dominance in desktop operating systems, Windows is the platform most targetted by spyware, viruses, and ransomware. This is poor reasoning and a misunderstanding of how security works. Any org should be happy with any OS, as long as sufficient security controls for it exist. Anyone who oversees Windows estates, or works in desktop security, can tell you that they exist and are extensive, a…

> More tenuous reasoning - macOS is not 'free'.

So very obtuse of them to word it this way. Windows has a cheaper license for HOME users who don't need Pro features of a business. It's not the other way.

Definitely a c-level with an axe to grind.

Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#103

Post by jaywalk »

mikeryan wrote: post #68
Xylakant wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I‘m a bit surprised that they care about the cost so much - the Dell laptops and the Apple Laptops come in at a price point of 2000 - 3000 USD and the Dell they specifically recommend for Linux use comes with Windows Pro preinstalled. The price difference to the equivalent Linux version is around 70USD. That‘s a negligible difference, especially when you start comparing to the employees wage (It‘s probably about 1 ho…

Where did they mention cost concerns? I’m reading this that it’s an IT/procurement hassle dealing with the Windows Pro upgrade licenses, on a platform they don’t feel is secure, not a cost issue.

Any laptop above the absolute bottom tier can be purchased with a pre-installed Windows Professional license. It's a complete non-issue.

Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#104

Post by bart_spoon »

aikah wrote: post #64
ModernMech wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gitlab ships various ci runner executables for all platforms. I use their Windows ci runner and it works well, but I wonder how they test it without running windows.

> Gitlab ships various ci runner executables for all platforms. I use their Windows ci runner and it works well, but I wonder how they test it without running windows. Maybe with a Windows VM.

If that’s the case then Windows isn’t actually prohibited at Gitlab.

Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#105

Post by kazinator »

horsawlarway wrote: post #9

I'm no fan of Windows myself, but I find this a fairly bad policy. If nothing else - what's not used is not tested. And if you expect any real population of users to be using Windows machines with your products, you should have developers/PMs/QA/support interacting with your products using Windows machines. I see this as: We're saving a bit of money and making ITs life easier, and in exchange users will get a worse p…

This document seems to be about the machines that employees at Gitlab are given, not about target machines for testing and deploying software.

They probably have some Windows machines at Gitlab for verifying the experience of Gitlab users/customers who use Windows.

I imagine a developer doing that would have a dedicated Windows machine, or possibly a guest VM, for that activity.

Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#106

Post by 101008 »

arkitaip wrote: post #17
habnds wrote: post #3

>> GitLab approves the use of Linux, and Apple's macOS. Microsoft Windows is prohibited for the following reasons: Due to Microsoft Windows' dominance in desktop operating systems, Windows is the platform most targetted by spyware, viruses, and ransomware. macOS is preinstalled on Apple computers and Linux is available free of charge. To approve the use of Windows, GitLab would have to purchase Windows Professional l…

I haven't had problems with viruses, spyware and ransomware on Windows for years. Microsoft's builtin spyware marketed as telemetry and diagnostics otoh is very difficult to counter even with dedicated tools like O&O ShutUp10. I get why companies don't want to risk giving business secrets to Microsoft.

Hey, quick question. I have been the same for years, using Windows without any problems (at least that I know of!).

But soon I will have to go to the offices of the startup that I work for (I work remotely) and they all use Mac, and I am a bit worried if they start asking question about how I keep my computer secure. Anyone (not only parent author) can recommend something? A software to install or anything like that?

Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#107

Post by dijit »

PaulHoule wrote: post #2

It's a fairly odd that that IT cultures are segregated into places that have nothing but Macs and other places that have nothing but Windows. I think it's risky because a small computing monoculture can feel complete but commit a software business to failure at the very beginning by rejecting 90% of the potential market.

Microsoft ecosystem is really hard to dip a toe into.

Properly supporting a handful of machines practically means bringing AzureAD or Exchange. AzureAD brings in elements of Exchange (like outlook), which brings in weird default settings like teams/sharepoint/onedrive.

Apple has done a lot of work in supporting Microsoft Exchange, but it's still janky as hell (just browse r/macsysadmin and you'll see).

So, you have two choices.

1) support the monoculture, life will be easier.

2) get a bigger IT department.

People are happy to spend a boatload of money avoiding the second option, so, monoculture it is.

Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#108

Post by MattGaiser »

Havoc wrote: post #44

Doesn’t seem unreasonable. My work is entirely windows cause workload is primarily MS office Whatever works. There isn’t some sort of diversity and inclusion requirement for OSs

People would have accepted this reasoning had they claimed it.

Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#109

Post by kazinator »

sonofhans wrote: post #50
horsawlarway wrote: post #9

I'm no fan of Windows myself, but I find this a fairly bad policy. If nothing else - what's not used is not tested. And if you expect any real population of users to be using Windows machines with your products, you should have developers/PMs/QA/support interacting with your products using Windows machines. I see this as: We're saving a bit of money and making ITs life easier, and in exchange users will get a worse p…

I agree. If nothing else they won’t be able to replicate Windows typography, which is different from Linux and OS X. Base fonts are different; kerning and anti-aliasing are different. Web design is still 90% typography, and cutting the largest install base out of your test matrix seems silly to me.

I have a company laptop that runs Windows, but everything I work on runs on an ARM-based device.

Work computer != target machine

For about 20 years, I've not developed anything at work that runs on the work computer that is used for doing the development, documention, e-mailing and whatnot.

Re: Microsoft Windows is prohibited at Gitlab

#110

Post by trelane »

jchw wrote: post #61
ModernMech wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gitlab ships various ci runner executables for all platforms. I use their Windows ci runner and it works well, but I wonder how they test it without running windows.

This policy about which OS your laptop runs does not seem to preclude the use of Windows VMs (and presumably CI runners, though I bet we could see if that was the case ourselves) if it were needed. The open source nature of Gitlab also makes it easy for a developer to test things on an unprivileged personal device, I'd imagine. If that was not enough, I believe the CI runner is written in the Go programming language,…

This is exactly how I used to operate. I'd develop on Linux then ensure it works on Windows in a VM.
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