What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert? • Hacker News Board

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#101

Post by voakbasda » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:39 PM UTC

giraffe_lady wrote: post #13

oceanghost wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. I was once advised by HR to "try not to offend anyone." I asked the HR woman, "How do I know what offends any particular person?" She looked genuinely stumped.

If this is going to work you need to tell us what prompted this conversation so we can see how plausible it is to pretend you didn't know it was offensive.

I have had the exact same conversation with HR. Someone takes offense at something and they use it as leverage to suppress any further potential offenses, despite the fact that trying to avoid offending others is completely futile. Because once you accept that kind of policy, you become a target of abuse from others willing to claim offense at just about anything.

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#102

Post by ravenstine » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:39 PM UTC

sofixa wrote: post #36

ravenstine wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really makes me wonder what the common experience is for others not just in tech but Corporate America in general. I myself have run into anti-white and anti-male phenomena, unconscious bias pseudoscience training, diversity pledges, and so on, as have now others in my peer group. Dilbert's commentary has so far been entirely appropriate based on my experience, hence it's puzzling to me when people think there's s…

> Dilbert's commentary has so far been entirely appropriate based on my experience, hence it's puzzling to me when people think there's something particularly conservative about being concerned or critical about these societal changes Isn't it pretty much by definition (social) conservative ? > Conservatism is a cultural, social, and political philosophy that seeks to promote and to preserve traditional social instit…

In a reductionist sense, sure, to be critical of particular de novo political views is conservative. Yet no one would call progressives conservative or reactionary for opposing the overturning of Roe v Wade. Are progressives being conservative when they oppose nuclear energy? But somehow it's commonly recognized as being conservative to be critical of policies that single out particular groups (the original intent notwithstanding).

That is what I find peculiar. At least in the United States, being "conservative" or "progressive" and their various synonyms aren't really defined strictly by Miriam-Webster but by the zeitgeist.

> You might disagree with the changes being made, but (social) progressives believe they're making them for the betterment of humans.

Most people believe this of their own policies, not just progressives. That's a very unhelpful way of describing these two poles, as is relying on the dictionary.

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#103

Post by _gabe_ » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:39 PM UTC

fabian2k wrote: post #62

ravenstine wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really makes me wonder what the common experience is for others not just in tech but Corporate America in general. I myself have run into anti-white and anti-male phenomena, unconscious bias pseudoscience training, diversity pledges, and so on, as have now others in my peer group. Dilbert's commentary has so far been entirely appropriate based on my experience, hence it's puzzling to me when people think there's s…

Plain old racism/xenophobia and sexism was very common and still is to some extent, though it is not as socially acceptable as it used to be. So I find it odd to only consider anti-white bias you encountered while ignoring any discrimination in the other direction. I strongly doubt it does not exist. There is certainly stuff under the diversity banner, especially when done primarily with PR/image concerns that reason…

No post body was provided.

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#104

Post by simonh » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:39 PM UTC

romwell wrote: post #28

AinderS wrote: post #4

Simple. Workplace complaints and management priorities have changed, and Dilbert followed. When Dilbert started, the government wasn't yet training employees how to "interrupt whiteness" [1], or Coca-Cola how to "be less white" [2], or Cigna simply forbidding hiring whites [3], nor did academia require mandatory diversity pledges for new hires and promotions [4]. Dilbert is doing what we are told art is supposed to d…

Ah yes, diversity statments are the real problem in academia. Not, say, 10:1 PhD student to position ratio. Or exploitation. Or the visa slavery (accept all the crap, or get kicked out of the country you've been toiling for over the course of 10 years). Or $50K/yr being acceptable research professor's salary. Or the disgusting proportion of adjunct positions used as full-time. Or ( gasp ) actual lack of diversity. No…

>Not...., Not...., etc

Dilbert comics have lampooned pretty much all of those things.

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#105

Post by thereddaikon » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:40 PM UTC

rcarmo wrote: post #24

I used to love Dilbert because it echoed (down to every single minute detail) my work environment (which, like Adams', was a telco). Then it became creepy because it anticipated everything that was coming to pass (sometimes the very day, sometimes within a week, we'd have reorgs, discussions with Marketing, trips to our equivalent of Elbonia). The peak, for me, was when Dogbert was hailed as a cloud guru the week I s…

Ah Elbonia, the nation where every member of the government is secretly a traitor trying to sabotage them.

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#106

Post by MrMan » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:40 PM UTC

aldebran wrote: post #75

jacquesm wrote: post #38

He's gone off the deep end. I've seen the same happen with some friends and wrote about it, it's a sad thing when formerly intelligent human beings start losing it and fail to recover only to sink further and further into their own version of reality.

It feels like that started happening around 2014-2015. I genuinely wonder if he is afflicted with some mental issue. I stopped following him and the comics when he started blogging about how great trump was.

its social media addiction in Adam's case. the same thing is happening in the large to the whole country

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#107

Post by blueflow » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:40 PM UTC

voakbasda wrote: post #101

giraffe_lady wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If this is going to work you need to tell us what prompted this conversation so we can see how plausible it is to pretend you didn't know it was offensive.

I have had the exact same conversation with HR. Someone takes offense at something and they use it as leverage to suppress any further potential offenses, despite the fact that trying to avoid offending others is completely futile. Because once you accept that kind of policy, you become a target of abuse from others willing to claim offense at just about anything.

Dumb idea... what if you play the game yourself? They can't proof you are just pretending to be offended.

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#108

Post by romwell » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:41 PM UTC

nmilo wrote: post #69

romwell wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yes, diversity statments are the real problem in academia. Not, say, 10:1 PhD student to position ratio. Or exploitation. Or the visa slavery (accept all the crap, or get kicked out of the country you've been toiling for over the course of 10 years). Or $50K/yr being acceptable research professor's salary. Or the disgusting proportion of adjunct positions used as full-time. Or ( gasp ) actual lack of diversity. No…

Who the hell said that was the real problem in academia, as if it was the only problem there? Are we not allowed to talk about a problem if some greater problem also exists?

> Are we not allowed to talk about a problem if some greater problem also exists?

Being facetious, are we?

Talking about petty nuisances related to trying to solve the greater problem while not even mentioning what the greater problem is usually an indicator that you don't see the greater problem as a problem.

The greater problems being racism and transphobia in the context of this discussion.

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#109

Post by kemayo » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:41 PM UTC

I used to read Dilbert when I was a kid in the 90s, which perhaps made me a weird kid. With that background, it's actually quite strange to see the examples of recent strips this article presents -- because they show the pointy-haired boss as the "reasonable" character. His role earlier on was almost-always as the deranged influence of management, causing problems for others. (I feel that a similar joke ~20 years ago would probably have used Dilbert as the viewpoint character, frustrated at his coworkers' abuses of the system.)

Seeing him framed as the audience-identification character suggests things about Adams' shifting viewpoint, I guess?

Re: What the Hell Is Up with Dilbert?

#110

Post by the_doctah » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 2:42 PM UTC

romwell wrote: post #28

AinderS wrote: post #4

Simple. Workplace complaints and management priorities have changed, and Dilbert followed. When Dilbert started, the government wasn't yet training employees how to "interrupt whiteness" [1], or Coca-Cola how to "be less white" [2], or Cigna simply forbidding hiring whites [3], nor did academia require mandatory diversity pledges for new hires and promotions [4]. Dilbert is doing what we are told art is supposed to d…

Ah yes, diversity statments are the real problem in academia. Not, say, 10:1 PhD student to position ratio. Or exploitation. Or the visa slavery (accept all the crap, or get kicked out of the country you've been toiling for over the course of 10 years). Or $50K/yr being acceptable research professor's salary. Or the disgusting proportion of adjunct positions used as full-time. Or ( gasp ) actual lack of diversity. No…

[flagged]