The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs • Hacker News Board

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#101

Post by vorpalhex » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:21 PM UTC

criddell wrote: post #16

NickC25 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably a mix of both. People who have some experience with drugs might want the benefit of the trip, but people who are a little more hesitant of the idea of mind-altering substances that last 8+ hours, such as LSD, might be more comfortable with some sort of watered-down experience backed by a major pharma brand and delivered by a licensed therapist. Of course, drug companies and lobbyists also dream of such outco…

Is an inexpensive drug that can "cure" PTSD after a very small number of doses a dream or nightmare for drug companies and lobbyists?

Someone does lsd and shoots up a gas station.

Was it the lsd or were they just already nutters? Nobody knows.

Telling people to take strong drugs that are purity tested and in a supervised clinical setting is sensible, not some conspiracy.

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#102

Post by vorpalhex » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:23 PM UTC

tastyfreeze wrote: post #57

engineer_22 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What could possibly go wrong?

Shamanic rituals have been the cornerstone of many of the great civilizations of the past. Why are substances that induce introspection and a sense of belonging to something greater than yourself banned?

Sometimes they cause psychotic breaks and Timmy eats off Becca's ear or runs buck naked into the woods and dies.

You know, that sorta stuff.

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#103

Post by cannaceo » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:24 PM UTC

throw819352119 wrote: post #66

I have a friend who has severe depression, including self harm and thoughts of suicide. So far guided meditation sessions and antidepressants have had little effect. I have read that some illicit drugs can be effective in treating depression, even after just one or two uses. Can anyone suggest what might be the best option out of ketamine, shrooms, LSD or MDMA?

Ayahuasca, then MDMA.

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#104

Post by TaupeRanger » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:25 PM UTC

heap_perms wrote: post #21

NickC25 wrote: post #5

There was an NYT article not too long ago whose entire point is that "true" psychedelic drugs are too dangerous to go mainstream, but isolated chemical compounds that provide some of the chemical effects of LSD / Mushrooms / Ketamine without the "trip" were a much better way to go. The reasoning was that they could engineer a way to chemically induce neuroplastic change in the brain without the liability of visual or…

" Talk about missing the forest from the trees. The whole transformative experience is the "trip" itself. " I couldn't agree more. In fact, the trip itself is not a nice side effect, it's the precondition to get measurable, long-term positive changes.

That is a claim that would require a study to confirm. No such study has been done to my knowledge.

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#105

Post by jokowueu » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:25 PM UTC

elevaet wrote: post #95

jokowueu wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i have tried all the psychadelics that dont provide "trips" . all of them were complete failures yet they show effects on mice for some reason but when did that ever matter. The only interesting one that was impressive was tabernanthalog but even though it didn't produce a twitch response in mice it clearly had a psychadelic effect

How did you end up getting to test tabernanthalog and these other novel compounds?

I belong to a group where we group our money together to either get the required precursors to make them or hire chemists over seas . It's quite easy but larger quantities are required to bring down the cost

There are a lot of other substances as well just recently we were able to procure very cheap rapamycin for people with autoimmune issues

If you are interested in joining or just look around reply to me here

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#106

Post by vorpalhex » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:25 PM UTC

throw819352119 wrote: post #66

I have a friend who has severe depression, including self harm and thoughts of suicide. So far guided meditation sessions and antidepressants have had little effect. I have read that some illicit drugs can be effective in treating depression, even after just one or two uses. Can anyone suggest what might be the best option out of ketamine, shrooms, LSD or MDMA?

Please don't give your severely depressed friend random street drugs in hopes it will magically help them.

You are not equipped to purity test them, severely depressed people can become more suicidal on rebounds, and you are almost certainly not equipped to care for them if they hit a major health issue.

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#107

Post by vorpalhex » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:27 PM UTC

stocknoob wrote: post #46

engineer_22 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What could possibly go wrong?

What could possibly go wrong with a society full of people living unexamined lives?

Mostly they end up kind of boring or being jerks. That is a very well known outcome.

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#108

Post by TaylorAlexander » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:33 PM UTC

akvadrako wrote: post #51

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I love my therapist, and research suggests that psychedelic assisted therapy is effective. I've never taken a large dose of mushrooms because I am nervous about where it would take me, so personally doing that with my therapist could be pretty nice. Tho expensive lol. I've only really done LSD once tho and it was interesting, and seemed more low key than shrooms, so maybe I should try that again.

Well you can get a guide (or just an experienced friend) for less than a therapist. Also, LSD is not lower key than shrooms; maybe you took a smaller dose or personally have a tolerance. But with high doses they can both be very intense.

Shrooms bring up a lot of emotions for me, while LSD felt more cerebral. I found the LSD easier to deal with. But then, I have less experience with it.

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#109

Post by TaylorAlexander » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:34 PM UTC

ActorNightly wrote: post #56

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I love my therapist, and research suggests that psychedelic assisted therapy is effective. I've never taken a large dose of mushrooms because I am nervous about where it would take me, so personally doing that with my therapist could be pretty nice. Tho expensive lol. I've only really done LSD once tho and it was interesting, and seemed more low key than shrooms, so maybe I should try that again.

You likely did a starter dose of LSD. Also, it doesn't depend on stomach processing to activate, which means its not diet dependent - shrooms very much are. Plenty of people make a mistake of taking shrooms after eating a meal, not getting anything after an hour, taking more thinking their shrooms are weak, and then when it hits they are taken for quite a ride. The right way to dose shrooms IMO is not eating 4 hours…

Oh sure. Yeah I've done all that, including growing them. And I always take them on an empty stomach. The thing is that shrooms bring up a lot of deep emotions for me which can be hard to handle. I don't have much experience with LSD but that trip was more cerebral and easier to deal with than the emotional roller coaster of shroom trips I've had. Maybe it was just the dosage, I don't know.

Re: The high-stakes race to engineer new psychedelic drugs

#110

Post by rrrrrrrrrrrryan » Tue, Aug 02, 2022, 9:41 PM UTC

mkoryak wrote: post #22

NickC25 wrote: post #5

There was an NYT article not too long ago whose entire point is that "true" psychedelic drugs are too dangerous to go mainstream, but isolated chemical compounds that provide some of the chemical effects of LSD / Mushrooms / Ketamine without the "trip" were a much better way to go. The reasoning was that they could engineer a way to chemically induce neuroplastic change in the brain without the liability of visual or…

sounds like you had a good trip. If you had a bad trip, you might feel differently about it.

"Good trip" and "bad trip" are older terms created by recreational drug users who wanted to get high and have a good time.

Today, in therapeutic contexts, they use "easy trip" and "difficult trip" to give patients a sense of what to expect, and some context for how to interpret the experience they're about to have.

Some trips are like tropical vacations; peaceful respites. But others feel closer to climbing a perilous mountain, or trekking through endless desert, or slogging through dark marshlands.

Some of the most fulfilling journeys in life can be quite uncomfortable and hard, and notably, 70% of people that have bad/difficult trips do not regret the experience.

What makes the trip is worthwhile is if it causes you to learn and grow in a meaningful way.