France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon • Hacker News Board

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#101

Post by WalterBright » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:21 PM UTC

bduerst wrote: post #79

WalterBright wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My meaning is a bit subtler than your interpretation. I was commenting on the practice of virtue signalling. For example, Seattle rebuilt and renamed the old Key Arena into Climate Pledge Arena. While I am a more ardent environmentalist than most (my virtue signalling duly noted) this name is a local pinnacle of vacuous virtue signalling nonsense.

Just FYI, Virtue Signalling is a pejorative that implicitly marginalizes and accuses someone of abnormal behavior. The GP here is calling that out even if you didn't specifically use the term "virtue signalling" in your original comment - the behavior here is entirely normal. The phrase's roots come from the alt-right looking for a replacement for SJW accusations not being taken seriously: https://rationalwiki.org/wi…

Virtue signalling is not at all abnormal behavior. People have done that since talking evolved. Everybody does it to some extent.

And since I pointed out my own virtue signal, have I marginalized myself with abnormal behavior?

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#102

Post by ineedasername » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:22 PM UTC

saddlerustle wrote: post #38

bduerst wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, we've successfully reduced spending on Amazon by >90% in our household. There are still some obscure items that, due to the sheer spread of Amazon, are incredibly difficult to get anywhere else, online or off - but that was Amazon's original market benefit to begin with. You could always get that weird book on Amazon that you couldn't get in the book store.

Good for you. For me, after the local grocery store went to shit, with Prime Now and Amazon Fresh I've shifted almost all our spending to Amazon.

Yep-- high risk during covid and lack of local delivery capacity, not to mention empty store shelves, meant Amazon Fresh was the alternative. I was fortunate that literally just a few weeks before the shutdown I had been sick and couldn't go foodshopping so I used Fresh for the first time. That made me an existing customer, and when the shutdown hit they weren't taking new ones.

Even then, I was up to 1:00am in the morning a lot of times waiting for delivery slots to open. And then Amazon began releasing delivery slots incrementally throughout the day, which probably made it more equitable but also meant I had to constantly refresh the checkout page a dozen times an hour to get one instead of being quick on the draw after midnight.

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#103

Post by anamax » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:23 PM UTC

tpush wrote: post #66

WalterBright wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was in B+N last summer, and as I recall they had 6 full shelves of "Trump Is Bad" books. I amuse myself by collecting them, and have 36 so far (all different). I pick them up at the thrift store for a buck or two. I started a Biden collection, but only one book so far. Things that make you go hmmmm....

Presumably there are more "Trump is bad" (weird simplification, but ok) books than ones on Biden because a) Trump has been president longer and b) Trump's actions harmed more people.

How about "more people want to buy a 'Trump is bad' book than a 'Biden is bad' book?"

People buy, or don't buy, books for all sorts of reasons. (For example, some people show off their books.)

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#104

Post by tshaddox » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:24 PM UTC

caslon wrote: post #3

Is there a word for laws that disproportionately affect people in rural areas so that a government can play protectionist for urban companies? I hate Amazon as much as anyone, but in this case they're definitely not wrong , even if they're probably lying about their reasoning.

I don't know if there's a word for that, but it certainly seems like it would be exceedingly rare. Don't people in rural areas have vastly disproportionately large representation in government, public spending per capita, etc.? Of course, I'm just basing this on my intuition in the United States. My intuition could be way off, or France could be quite different.

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#105

Post by hn_throwaway_99 » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:24 PM UTC

throwaway789257 wrote: post #50

France has a long history of attempting to protect its cultural industries, including film and publishing. It's not wrong. There are other things that are important aside from customer purchasing power. Amazon is using its economies of scale to drive out smaller businesses. It is not unique in that. But the industries that Amazon affects may be unique to the nations that wish to preserve them. Most centralization inc…

I'd also note that, at least in my experience, the "book culture" in France is much more than we think of even small booksellers in the US.

That is, in the US the vision is generally something along the lines of Amazon vs. small independent stores a la "You've Got Mail".

In France, there are big, multi-day book fairs that take up large swaths of major cities. I visited Lyon during the Quais du Polar festival years ago, which is a 3 or 4 day event focused just on the crime fiction genre. I've never experienced anything like that in the US.

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#106

Post by simlevesque » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:26 PM UTC

chrisseaton wrote: post #100

throwaway789257 wrote: post #50

France has a long history of attempting to protect its cultural industries, including film and publishing. It's not wrong. There are other things that are important aside from customer purchasing power. Amazon is using its economies of scale to drive out smaller businesses. It is not unique in that. But the industries that Amazon affects may be unique to the nations that wish to preserve them. Most centralization inc…

> It's not wrong. Who's judging the quality, if not the consumers? If people loved French content they'd buy it in droves from Amazon anyway. If they don't... why not?

With this mentality, we'd have as many cultures as we have social networks... Pretty much one global dominant network. If that's the world you want, that's fine.

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#107

Post by ineedasername » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:26 PM UTC

coolso wrote: post #40

WalterBright wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I hate Amazon as much as anyone The fashionable thing to say, indeed! Yet the anyones are all covertly buying from Amazon, working for Amazon, and investing in Amazon.

I’ve cut back on my Amazon purchases 90%. It’s been nice visiting actual stores and getting something same-hour. Sometimes I pay a dollar or two more. But buying local(er) feels good for my soul. It’s nice not having to wonder if every single positive review is real or fake, or if real, if it’s accurate. It’s also nice not having to sift through direct-from-China products with extremely strange names and poorly writt…

It’s nice not having to wonder if every single positive review is real or fake

Unless you're getting your reviews from friends and family, you should still probably wonder if they're fake.

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#108

Post by chrisseaton » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:28 PM UTC

simlevesque wrote: post #106

chrisseaton wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not wrong. Who's judging the quality, if not the consumers? If people loved French content they'd buy it in droves from Amazon anyway. If they don't... why not?

With this mentality, we'd have as many cultures as we have social networks... Pretty much one global dominant network. If that's the world you want, that's fine.

> If that's the world you want, that's fine.

Well what do people want?! Is anyone asking?

If people aren't buying French literature from French bookshops without Government subsidy... then maybe people don't want that.

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#109

Post by kyleee » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:33 PM UTC

WalterBright wrote: post #97

tpush wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Presumably there are more "Trump is bad" (weird simplification, but ok) books than ones on Biden because a) Trump has been president longer and b) Trump's actions harmed more people.

> weird simplification Nothing weird about it. Allow me to grace you with a smattering of some of the titles: "Above The Law", "A Warning", "American Carnage", "Collusion", "Commander In Cheat", "Devil's Bargain", "Disloyal", "Fear", "Hoax", "Fire and Fury", "Rage", "The Dangerous Case of Donald Trump", "Unbelievable", ... Need I go on?

It's basically a genre of fan fiction at this point

Re: France moves to shield its book industry from Amazon

#110

Post by tshaddox » Tue, Oct 26, 2021, 11:35 PM UTC

WalterBright wrote: post #64

saurik wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this somehow supposed to be inconsistent? One normally doesn't hate Amazon because they are successful, but because they are too successful. This is like claiming making fun of someone who says they hate cigarettes or alcohol because they are "covertly" still using both all the time, or someone who says they hate the food at their school cafeteria despite "covertly" eating it... this "you don't get to say you hate…

My meaning is a bit subtler than your interpretation. I was commenting on the practice of virtue signalling. For example, Seattle rebuilt and renamed the old Key Arena into Climate Pledge Arena. While I am a more ardent environmentalist than most (my virtue signalling duly noted) this name is a local pinnacle of vacuous virtue signalling nonsense.

All names of professional sports stadiums are arbitrary and vacuous. It's not like there was some "real name" the building had that got surreptitiously erased or covered up by "virtue signalers."