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After the pandemic, we can’t go back to sleep (2020)

theanarchistlibrary.org

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Re: After the pandemic, we can’t go back to sleep (2020)

#101

Post by commandlinefan »

wefarrell wrote: post #78
soared wrote: post #39

Meh. I’ve seen a lot of these short essays about how after the pandemic we either should not or simply will not return to the status quo. It doesn’t really do anything to say “the economy doesn’t work” in 5 paragraphs and then say nothing else. Yes, lots of poor people are getting screwed. Some jobs don’t pay well despite the higher moral standing of directly assisting others. The environment looks pretty bad. But yo…

At the very least we need Federally mandated sick days. My mother caught COVID at the beginning of March of 2020 from a coworker who knew her husband had it but continued to come into work out of fear of losing her job. It's crazy that it would happen again during the next pandemic. Meanwhile 20 years after 9/11 we're still taking off our shoes to get on airplanes.

> out of fear of losing her job

Wait, are you saying she was actually threatened with being fired if she didn't come in sick or that she just thought that she might be? If the latter, no federal mandate would change that - I get sick days, but I feel weird taking them, like I'm getting a black mark on my employment record that will come back to haunt me later. No law can change that, that's just how our society (currently) is.

Re: After the pandemic, we can’t go back to sleep (2020)

#102

Post by kkjjkgjjgg »

c54 wrote: post #10
olalonde wrote: post #5

It's strange to see this upvoted on HN of all places. Some marxist inspired ramblings with no clear conclusion. Fact is that the free enterprise system works very well when you let it work and this is backed by a lot of empirical data.

Common misconception, examples are the 40hr work week and banning of payment in scrip in the 1800s. Another example is that monopolies require legislation or they have the effect of “seizing up” the dynamics of a functioning marketplace and turning toxic. Semiconductor patents being made public and telecom copper being made open to use by other companies are both pretty well understood examples of legislation that he…

What do you mean by the 40h work week as an example? Example for what? It was an idea by Ford, but I guess then the unions jumped on it?

Who is forcing you to work 40h? I personally don't do that. You are free to negotiate your own contracts.

Re: After the pandemic, we can’t go back to sleep (2020)

#103

Post by t-3 »

freeflight wrote: post #29
wallacoloo wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Markets are created by governments and don’t just spring from anywhere whole cloth. ok, then what of the cryptocurrency drug markets? those were created by govt? no. there’s so many instances of unorganized humans doing trade. markets are just a more organized form of trade, and goverment is but one way to achieve that organization.

> ok, then what of the cryptocurrency drug markets? those were created by govt? Indirectly yes, right now one of their biggest selling points is not being in the legal realm of government regulated markets. If the government were to legalize drugs/endorse crypto that dynamic would heavily change, the black variants of these markets would lose quite a big part of their appeal and thus the demand for them and ultimatel…

> There has to be some form of authority enforcing rules, or else you end up with a very anarchistic form of "market" where everything goes. That "everything" ranges from mundanities, like making a "business model" out of cheating people, to selling people like property because when there's a buyer, who has the right the stop me from selling?

Your anarchy already exists, and they fight with lawyers to decide the winner. Businesses with exactly the vision you describe exist everywhere. Government enables this kind of trickery.

Re: After the pandemic, we can’t go back to sleep (2020)

#104

Post by jk20 »

astura wrote: post #79
jk20 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How was the book on bullshit jobs debunked? The idea is that many jobs do not contribute to "technology,healthcare,engineering, etc.", rather, salaries and work assignments are regulated to simply force people to spend most of their lives doing meaningless activities as a form of social control. Even Ted Kaczynski talked about "surrogate activities".

HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27392455

>Furthermore, those who work in clerical and administrative jobs are far less likely to view their jobs as useless than those who are employed in roles that Mr Graeber regarded as essential...

Of course, if you are assigned an easy and well-paid box-ticking job, your sense of importance goes up, but taxpayers and those who have to plough through the bureaucracy created by you would beg to differ.

Re: After the pandemic, we can’t go back to sleep (2020)

#105

Post by dude187 »

vinceguidry wrote: post #77
zohch wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The current system created artificial scarcity The current system has been responsible for creating actual abundance that has vastly improved the living conditions of the vast majority of people. Scarcity is the default state, not artificial.

The 'vast majority of people' have not had their lives improved. They were, and still are, given a Squid Game-esque choice to either participate in a status-seeking game to destroy your health for someone else's comfort or exist in total squalor, dependent on other people who are destroying their health so that you can exist on the crumbs they throw your way. Capitalism seems more or less benign in affluent nations w…

Capitalism has greatly increased the quality of life across the board

Re: After the pandemic, we can’t go back to sleep (2020)

#107

Post by rpmisms »

macintux wrote: post #87
rpmisms wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, everyone should know how. Subsistence is incredibly rewarding.

I can't even pull weeds without ending up in bed due to a bad back.

Look into the Coleman Hoe. High-precision weeding tool that is very easy on the back.

Re: After the pandemic, we can’t go back to sleep (2020)

#109

Post by mojzu »

kkjjkgjjgg wrote: post #100
jk20 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How was the book on bullshit jobs debunked? The idea is that many jobs do not contribute to "technology,healthcare,engineering, etc.", rather, salaries and work assignments are regulated to simply force people to spend most of their lives doing meaningless activities as a form of social control. Even Ted Kaczynski talked about "surrogate activities".

The irony is that the socialist system he wished for produces the most bullshit jobs, as in bureaucracy upon bureaucracy. That's also the simple solution to why they exist: governments don't really care about efficiency, as they don't spend their own money. So you have bullshit jobs in bureaucracy, and in people having to cater to bureaucracy.

There are plenty of cases of efficient and inefficient processes in both capitalist and socialist systems, if any can be described as being wholly one or the other anymore. As a direct example to your point, compare the amount of bureaucracy in the US healthcare system to the UK's NHS (and how much extra that costs people per capita), or many other countries that are described as having socialist healthcare systems

Re: After the pandemic, we can’t go back to sleep (2020)

#110

Post by dragontamer »

commandlinefan wrote: post #101
wefarrell wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the very least we need Federally mandated sick days. My mother caught COVID at the beginning of March of 2020 from a coworker who knew her husband had it but continued to come into work out of fear of losing her job. It's crazy that it would happen again during the next pandemic. Meanwhile 20 years after 9/11 we're still taking off our shoes to get on airplanes.

> out of fear of losing her job Wait, are you saying she was actually threatened with being fired if she didn't come in sick or that she just thought that she might be? If the latter, no federal mandate would change that - I get sick days, but I feel weird taking them, like I'm getting a black mark on my employment record that will come back to haunt me later. No law can change that, that's just how our society (curr…

> No law can change that, that's just how our society (currently) is.

Laws can change society, through propaganda. See "Click it or Ticket" campaigns, and the like.

A simple PSA / Propaganda effort of "If you're sick with COVID19, stay at home. Federally mandated leave demands it", would probably go a long way. Maybe something like 'Use your sick days, they're a promised benefit of US Law', or "True Americans stay home when they're sick". (Etc. etc. I'm not good with PSA videos, but give it to some Hollywood artist and have them figure out the details, lol)

The WW2 propaganda levied upon the population was incredibly epic in size and scope, and was key to building US national unity and drumming up support for the war.

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There was that Bangladesh mask study, showing that something like 30+% of people would listen to masking advice/propaganda from religious leaders, in that 400+ village study. (200 villages as the control, 200 villages as the experiment. Found a bunch of religious leaders who would push pro-Mask statements and then ran the experiment). 10% of people wore masks before the study, 40% of the experiment-group wore masks after the study (so 30% of people were "affected").

No, that's not 100%. But changing even a fraction of the population would have huge effects.

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