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Python 3.11

docs.python.org

101–110 of 156 posts

Re: Python 3.11

#101

Python is deceptive. They lure you in with its simplicity, and then one day you want to deploy your software and you realize that it's more complicated than any other programming language ever conceived of.

It's probably the most voiced complaint these days, unless core devs are deaf, I bet ten solid dollars they're gonna address that soon.

It’s been like this for over a decade. I wouldn’t hold my breath. By comparison, I’m pretty sure the Ruby community adopted bundler over a decade ago.

Re: Python 3.11

#102

Python is deceptive. They lure you in with its simplicity, and then one day you want to deploy your software and you realize that it's more complicated than any other programming language ever conceived of.

I don't know; I've just written something in .net/c# and it's pretty bloddy difficult to deploy.

.NET can export self-contained single-file executable that doesn't require any runtime on the target computer/server.

Python has solutions like PyInstaller, but it's not built-in and requires building on the same system. In .NET, you can use the built-in tools to export binaries for Linux from Windows.

Re: Python 3.11

#103
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you be more specific about your claims? What is wrong with Python? > more complicated than any other programming language ever conceived of is definitely untrue. Even if you take only mainstream languages then there are many more annoying to deploy, ones that are more complicated and so on.

Dependency management in python is much worse than most mainstream languages.

Here I agree, but it is quite far away from

> more complicated than any other programming language ever conceived of

Re: Python 3.11

#104

Python is deceptive. They lure you in with its simplicity, and then one day you want to deploy your software and you realize that it's more complicated than any other programming language ever conceived of.

This comment is deceptive. This is a solved problem with virtualenvs. It is why Piku (https://github.com/piku) can deploy isolated apps with ease (and actually devotes less than 80 lines of code to the actual Python deployment).

Re: Python 3.11

#105
post #6

just spent about 4 hrs getting Python 2 and pip setup on my Mac. Any time I have the misfortune of needing to use python I get cold sweats at the thought of the environment stuff. Why is this still such a massive problem?

This too is a solved problem. First of all, the bundled Python 3 in Big Sur is perfectly OK and works fine (it’s become my default after years of pyenv).

Second, brew and pyenv “just work” if you need any other version. I’ve been developing in Python for decades, and it is one of the cleanest and easier approaches to running multiple runtimes I’ve used in any language.

Re: Python 3.11

#106

> When printing tracebacks, the interpreter will now point to the exact expression that caused the error instead of just the line. For example: Traceback (most recent call last): File "distance.py", line 11, in print(manhattan_distance(p1, p2)) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ File "distance.py", line 6, in manhattan_distance return abs(point_1.x - point_2.x) + abs(point_1.y - point_2.y) ^^^^^^^^^ AttributeError: 'NoneType…

Really wish they'd just go and add a way to replace better-exceptions[0]. I don't use it anymore and thus don't really like to maintain it these days, and would love to see it in mainline.

[0] https://GitHub.com/qix-/better-exceptions

Re: Python 3.11

#107
post #104

Python is deceptive. They lure you in with its simplicity, and then one day you want to deploy your software and you realize that it's more complicated than any other programming language ever conceived of.

This comment is deceptive. This is a solved problem with virtualenvs. It is why Piku ( https://github.com/piku ) can deploy isolated apps with ease (and actually devotes less than 80 lines of code to the actual Python deployment).

Thanks for taking the opportunity to advertise your own product, but it doesn't solve the problem.

Re: Python 3.11

#108
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Between this link and the OP, we're seeing the first improvements to drop from Mark Shannon's Microsoft-funded full-time work on CPython optimization, alongside Eric Snow and Guido van Rossum: https://www.theregister.com/2021/05/19/faster_python_mark_sh... https://github.com/markshannon/faster-cpython/blob/master/pl... - indicates that this is step 2 of 4, where the forthcoming steps actually plan to introduce JIT co…

With Python style favoring exceptions, I could see just the zero-cost try alone being a meaningful improvement.

On fact, for loops are try/except under the hood.

Re: Python 3.11

#109
post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment is deceptive. This is a solved problem with virtualenvs. It is why Piku ( https://github.com/piku ) can deploy isolated apps with ease (and actually devotes less than 80 lines of code to the actual Python deployment).

Thanks for taking the opportunity to advertise your own product, but it doesn't solve the problem.

It’s not a product. It’s an example of why it isn’t a problem, and it was actually _designed_ around virtualenvs, which is why it’s just a single script (again, not a product).

Re: Python 3.11

#110
post #6

just spent about 4 hrs getting Python 2 and pip setup on my Mac. Any time I have the misfortune of needing to use python I get cold sweats at the thought of the environment stuff. Why is this still such a massive problem?

Because python 2 has been unsupported for more than a year.
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