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“Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

saremba.de

101–110 of 115 posts

Re: “Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

#101
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Im not familiar with chess - why do some games last that long? Or was it multiple games?

It’s one game that lasts so long. This was traditionally played by players exchanging moves via letters sent by post. Naturally people use the internet more these days, but with a lot of time allowed between moves to keep the slow pace of correspondence chess. Allowing this amount of time between moves completely changes the character of the game. There’s ample time of deep analysis and research. There’s more incenti…

Oh interesting, thanks for the explanation!

Re: “Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

#102
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's too surprising, I doubt you can play chess at a high level with early stages of Alzheimer's.

I think what they meant was that they’d never heard of someone who was at any point in time a high level chess player eventually succumbing to Alzheimer’s.

Or he simply forgot.

Re: “Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

#103
post #59

Please never show these rules to a general AI and ask it to win a chess match...

As an aside, would it be ethical to restrict an AGI to a single purpose? It sort of reminds me of Rick’s butter robot from Rick and Morty

AGI can find their own purposes in addition to one it was created for. Same way people find life purposes beyond maintaining and propagating germline.

Re: “Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

#105
post #68

This occurred in a game of mine. I play(ed) international correspondence chess. The games can go on for years. In one of my games, my opponent sadly passed away. The game was adjuticated to a draw nine months after we had started. I did not have much personal connection with my opponent or interaction beyond our moves and an initial greeting, but it was obviously an extremely sad way for the game to end. Edit: the te…

Im not familiar with chess - why do some games last that long? Or was it multiple games?

There are other games which can lost pretty long. Online strategy multiplayer games like Dominions 5 or other PBEM games (play by email) can last for months as each turns is allowed a day and there are 60-80 turns in an average game.

Re: “Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

#106
post #51
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Makes perfect sense. You can't win king vs king+pawn ever. As such even if opponent died in such situation you don't get win.

> You can't win king vs king+pawn ever Pawns can get promoted, so there are are many king vs king + pawn positions that are a win for the player having the pawn.

The importance of anticipating and gaining the 'opposition'.

Re: “Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

#107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would certainly get your name in the history books and secure a legacy of infamy. A high ego grandmaster on the decline may decide loss of the remainder of their freedom in life is worth the sacrifice.

You have to be in a Stronger passion before your opponent died.

I meant “you would have to be in a stronger position upon the death of your opponent for the match to be adjudicated in your favor”

Re: “Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

#108
post #94
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Making a move does not necessarily shift the turn to your opponent. You can have a position where all of your possible legal moves stalemate your opponent, in which case your move immediately ends that game and is the last move of the game. Tangentially, this reminds me of an amusing chess conundrum. Is it possible for a position to occur in a legal game of chess where all pieces and pawns are on the board, all of th…

> Is it possible for a position to occur in a legal game of chess where all pieces and pawns are on the board, all of them are on their original squares, and white does not have the move? No, and that's quite easy to prove: With all pawns on their original position, the only valid moves are by knights and rooks, and for each such move the moving piece changes the color of space it occupies (for rooks that's because t…

You are 100% correct that if a position is ever reached where everything has returned to the initial position, white must have the move.

But note that I asked if white has the move any time a position occurs where everything is in its initial position, and so we must also consider the initial position before any move has made.

When the pieces are in their initial positions before the first move has made, does white have the move? You would think so, but actually that is not the case. Nor does black have the move.

The FIDE Laws of Chess define having the move thusly:

> The game of chess is played between two opponents who move their pieces alternately on a square board called a ‘chessboard’. The player with the white pieces commences the game. A player is said to ‘have the move’, when his opponent’s move has been ‘made’.

Nobody has the move until while makes the first move, then black has the move.

This stupid way FIDE defines having the move can show up in another situation. Consider this game:

  1. Nf3 Nf6
  2. Ng1 Ng8
  3. Nf3 Nf6
  4. Ng1 Ng8
The initial position has now occurred 3 times (at the start, after move 2, and after move 4). Can white claim a draw by threefold repetition? Could black have claimed a draw before making 4. ...Ng8 by writing it on their scoresheet and informing the arbiter?

With the way FIDE defines having the move, the answer should be no. This is not yet threefold repetition. Part of FIDE's definition of a repeated position is that the same player has the move in both, and so the positions after move 2 and move 4 are not repetitions of the position at the start because white has the move in the later two but no one had the move in the former.

Re: “Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

#109
post #43

"death": losing player called to greater things, one hopes. An inspiringly optimistic spiritual outlook from the PGN standard, so thank you for that. Technically, over the board one could just wait until their deceased opponent flags to claim a win, but in practice, for every occasion I'm aware of in high level tournament play, the remaining player will adjudicate the game honestly according to their evaluation of th…

[deleted]

Re: “Death” one of 5 ways to lose at Chess, according to PGN standard

#110
post #38

The rules of chess are defined by the FIDE Handbook ( https://handbook.fide.com/chapter/E012018 ), not the PGN standard. Although the FIDE Handbook makes no explicit provision for the death of the player, it does say: “6.9. Except where one of Articles 5.1.1, 5.1.2, 5.2.1, 5.2.2, 5.2.3 applies, if a player does not complete the prescribed number of moves in the allotted time, the game is lost by that player. However,…

Makes perfect sense. You can't win king vs king+pawn ever. As such even if opponent died in such situation you don't get win.

King+pawn vs king can only be won if the other guy makes a mistake. However, the other guy can make a mistake. The draw situations are king+knight vs king or king+bishop vs king.
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