Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

trevorklee.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 128 posts

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#101

Post by harimau777 »

dillondoyle wrote: post #52
leksak wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Climber? I've had three pulley injuries and returned to sport. What, specifically, have you been doing to rehab it?

yup!! hang boarding, micro needling, some finger/arm exercises from PT. i climbed seriously as a kid until like 22 ish. then didn't for 7 ish years. it's now close to 2 years back (sep 24). I think that's the main issue, my skill/strength is higher than my fingers. Though I'm still decently strong just have pain/days I can't do much and fingers are weak compared to what I used to have. what about you? I've been think…

A little off topic, but what is your goal with the micro needling? I thought that was a purely cosmetic procedure for things like acne scars, but now I'm wondering if I missed something.

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#102

Post by rory »

klipt wrote: post #96
BadCookie wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think the author of the linked article understands either. Why is it obvious that myostatin inhibitors would ameliorate muscular dystrophy in mice but not humans? Nothing in this essay answers that question. Some people with certain types of muscular dystrophy spend years or even decades at near-normal muscle strength, so if you could return them to their previous muscle mass somehow, presumably it would do s…

> Why is it obvious that myostatin inhibitors would ameliorate muscular dystrophy in mice but not humans? It's not obvious, that's why we have clinical trials. What is obvious is that if your research process tests everything in mice first, and only tests in humans what already works in mice, you will find many treatments that work in mice but not humans. (Any treatment with the opposite character - works in humans b…

> Any treatment with the opposite character - works in humans but not mice - gets discarded by your process and never tested in humans

Which actually seems suboptimal in a case like this. We know the risks and side effects of steroids in the human body pretty well at this point, and they're not not too bad. If I had muscular dystrophy I'd probably be willing to give them a shot, even if they didn't work in mice.

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#103

Post by AlwaysRock »

nikita wrote: post #2

A different question. As someone who had to recover from Achilles tear and had to rebuild an atrophied calf muscle. Why don’t we just give anabolic steroids to people if their muscles atrophied after wearing a cast?

We could. And it would be about as safe as much medicine that we use today. But like many drugs that could be useful... steroids === bad.

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#104

Post by shepardrtc »

wisty wrote: post #22
gruez wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>As a result, when you end your cycle, your body needs to restart its natural test production. There can be a delay while this happens and it leads to unpleasant, though temporary, side effects, like weight gain and a loss of sexual appetite. Why not just slowly taper it off?

Test is injected into muscles, usually once every 2-4 weeks. It can't be taken orally. This makes dosage control difficult. The long half-life also means that your body's control systems are slow to act (if they reacted quickly then you'd risk ending up with too much, and be unable to get rid of it).

It has been recently found that you can inject it subcutaneously using insulin needles, which makes taking it much easier. Works just as well as intramuscular.

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#105

Post by BadCookie »

klipt wrote: post #96
BadCookie wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think the author of the linked article understands either. Why is it obvious that myostatin inhibitors would ameliorate muscular dystrophy in mice but not humans? Nothing in this essay answers that question. Some people with certain types of muscular dystrophy spend years or even decades at near-normal muscle strength, so if you could return them to their previous muscle mass somehow, presumably it would do s…

> Why is it obvious that myostatin inhibitors would ameliorate muscular dystrophy in mice but not humans? It's not obvious, that's why we have clinical trials. What is obvious is that if your research process tests everything in mice first, and only tests in humans what already works in mice, you will find many treatments that work in mice but not humans. (Any treatment with the opposite character - works in humans b…

Right. I completely agree that human clinical trials were required, but the essay claims that the results of the trial were “predictable” and “might seem pretty obvious.”

There’s a saying that it’s a great time to be a mouse with muscular dystrophy. It does seem like using mice as a model hasn’t worked very well, but I am not sure what the alternative might be (chimps?) or why researchers continue to use mice anyway. Edited to add: It would probably be emotionally/ethically more difficult to use chimps … they do some pretty awful things to the mice, making them run until they collapse repeatedly and then killing them at the end (for example).

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#106

Post by jakehilborn »

doix wrote: post #72
dillondoyle wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has anyone here used it? Or TB-500? I have a tendon/pulley injury that doesn't seem to want to heal and I've been researching it. At least one relevant study. There is one Dr. in my area (a gyno of all things) that has a website promoting his practice using it. So has at least a sheen of professionalism. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21030672/

I used both BPC-157 and TB-500 for a grade 4 SLAP tear. There are different surgeries used for SLAP tears, and I could not find a surgeon that would do the surgery I wanted (in the UK). I can't remember the exact details, but one is more risky and has a higher chance of returning to pre-surgery performance (normally athletes would take this option). The other is less risky but screws up your performance (general popu…

What caused the SLAP tear?

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#107

Post by doix »

jakehilborn wrote: post #106
doix wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used both BPC-157 and TB-500 for a grade 4 SLAP tear. There are different surgeries used for SLAP tears, and I could not find a surgeon that would do the surgery I wanted (in the UK). I can't remember the exact details, but one is more risky and has a higher chance of returning to pre-surgery performance (normally athletes would take this option). The other is less risky but screws up your performance (general popu…

What caused the SLAP tear?

Fell pretty hard while snowboarding.

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#108

Post by amai »

Actually steroids are used to treat people with muscular dystrophy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anabolic_steroid#Medical

But they have a lot of side effects: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anabolic_steroid#Adverse_effec...

Therefor scientists started to investigate different substances like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_androgen_receptor_mo...

But these might still have severe side effects (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ligandrol#Adverse_health_effec...)

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#109

Post by amai »

symlinkk wrote: post #16

Why are steroids even a controlled drug? If a man wants to use them and knows the risks he should be able to. Same with any drug I guess.

Why do you need to wear a safety belt in a car? If a man doesn't want to use them and knows the risks he should be able to. Same with any belt I guess.

Re: Why can't we just give steroids to people with muscular dystrophy?

#110

Post by Dylan16807 »

fullburley wrote: post #48
Dylan16807 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The muscle fibers are likely to fail but they still have muscles.

In the case of DMD, it's a matter of when and which (typically heart), not if. The muscle fibers turn into fiberous tissues that aren't functional muscle. They fail.

Well "matter of when" would still suggest that more is better, within reasonable bounds.

But if they turn into tissue that gets in the way, that would be a big reason not to want more. Is that the main reason?

Post reply on HN