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No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

reuters.com

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Re: No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

#101

Post by lionkor »

elcomet wrote: post #98
lionkor wrote: post #96

I know I'm the old man screaming at the clouds here, but the biggest problem I see with this is that it leads to engineers being pushed to outcompete these systems in iteration speed, which is impossible. An engineer might get the task to make some feature, and the manager goes and uses bubble to make it and sees it only takes an hour, the engineer sits there for 5 doing it, you can imagine the rest. The engineer mig…

I don't think that's gonna be a real problem after a short adaptation time. Managers will learn the limits of the tools. Of course, if a product made by bubble is sufficient to solve the problem, than the engineer did a bad job when making a custom solution.

That's fair, but you might as well just outsource all development if you're not going to use any code at all. It's the same liability, same opacity, etc.

Re: No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

#103

Post by IshKebab »

ldiracdelta wrote: post #18
deeviant wrote: post #10

I think the biggest problem with this approach is at some point, they necessarily reach a level of complexity that it takes the same amount of time to learn how to use their "no-code" tools than it does to just learn how to code.

I went down a foolish path once of trying to create a simple flow-diagram -> code generator for the business people to use in order to do some basic logic with regard to email escalations. Got it done and ..... the logic was still hard for them. Oh well. Guess that's why we're paid well.

Yeah maybe the point is that it isn't the actual code that's hard, it's the thinking. Like, you wouldn't try to make a no-equations maths system. It's not writing down e=mc² that's hard, it's figuring out that's what you want.

That said it's still way too hard to make web apps the "proper" way. I think there's space for something easier but I bet it will look more like Mathematica than LabVIEW.

Re: No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

#104

Post by minitoar »

zamalek wrote: post #93
deeviant wrote: post #10

I think the biggest problem with this approach is at some point, they necessarily reach a level of complexity that it takes the same amount of time to learn how to use their "no-code" tools than it does to just learn how to code.

My issue with no-code/low-code is that it puts the cart before the horse, or rather, the developer before the user. When you look at the amount of time spent staring at a screen, your users spend way more time (person-hours) looking at your app than you do coding it. Why all this focus on what is arguably the least important actor in the system?

Perhaps this is obvious but the answer is: cost. Developers are expensive. Delivering a viable poc cheaper, sooner, even if you end up having to redo it all anyway, can be an excellent trade off.

Re: No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

#105

Post by ramraj07 »

mrspeaker wrote: post #48
deeviant wrote: post #10

I think the biggest problem with this approach is at some point, they necessarily reach a level of complexity that it takes the same amount of time to learn how to use their "no-code" tools than it does to just learn how to code.

It works best for prototyping and rapidly testing ideas. I joined a startup that didn't have any deep coding skills - but had a great idea and vision for a product. They had made a pretty decent prototype with Bubble and could quickly implement suggestions from the beta testers. When I joined I instantly suggested re-writing it in a "real" stack. But when I dived into it, there was a lot of built in features of Bubbl…

People (especially the kind that hangs out in HN) dont seem to understand that there’s a vast ocean of fairly smart people, much smarter than the average (or even above average) programmer, who are unable to build what they can imagine because of the coding bottleneck. I know many, and it’s not for a lack of significant effort that they are not able to learn to code in a way that’s meaningful. I suppose there’s something in your brain that needs to click to write code? Anyways I’d much rather trust a product created by a team described in this comment than one written by a pure group of engineers.

Re: No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

#106

Post by paou »

ToJans wrote: post #89
modeless wrote: post #8

They named their startup 'Bubble'? Bold move.

Exactly my thought: couldn't find their exact turnover, but I assume it's less then 10M? How does this valuation work exactly? Could anyone elaborate?

As far as I know - investment amount / % shares of company - so if your cap table has total 10% for 100k it's a 1 mil valuation - whether an investor is willing to bet that is a different matter however :)

Re: No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

#107

Post by flarg »

ramraj07 wrote: post #105
mrspeaker wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It works best for prototyping and rapidly testing ideas. I joined a startup that didn't have any deep coding skills - but had a great idea and vision for a product. They had made a pretty decent prototype with Bubble and could quickly implement suggestions from the beta testers. When I joined I instantly suggested re-writing it in a "real" stack. But when I dived into it, there was a lot of built in features of Bubbl…

People (especially the kind that hangs out in HN) dont seem to understand that there’s a vast ocean of fairly smart people, much smarter than the average (or even above average) programmer, who are unable to build what they can imagine because of the coding bottleneck. I know many, and it’s not for a lack of significant effort that they are not able to learn to code in a way that’s meaningful. I suppose there’s somet…

In life sciences the people are smarter than any developer but software is IT-captured so all they can work with is Excel. No code is meant for these people. Software developers will never deliver what life sciences needs without no code.

Re: No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

#108

Post by GoblinSlayer »

deeviant wrote: post #10

I think the biggest problem with this approach is at some point, they necessarily reach a level of complexity that it takes the same amount of time to learn how to use their "no-code" tools than it does to just learn how to code.

How does it work for Excel?

Re: No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

#109

Post by soco »

flarg wrote: post #107
ramraj07 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People (especially the kind that hangs out in HN) dont seem to understand that there’s a vast ocean of fairly smart people, much smarter than the average (or even above average) programmer, who are unable to build what they can imagine because of the coding bottleneck. I know many, and it’s not for a lack of significant effort that they are not able to learn to code in a way that’s meaningful. I suppose there’s somet…

In life sciences the people are smarter than any developer but software is IT-captured so all they can work with is Excel. No code is meant for these people. Software developers will never deliver what life sciences needs without no code.

I was once hired to do exactly that - develop real software to replace the weird hacks those life science folk built by themselves. Boy were they happy after that. So I guess your mileage will vary by lots.

Re: No-code startup Bubble raises $100M

#110

Post by murukesh_s »

ramraj07 wrote: post #105
mrspeaker wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It works best for prototyping and rapidly testing ideas. I joined a startup that didn't have any deep coding skills - but had a great idea and vision for a product. They had made a pretty decent prototype with Bubble and could quickly implement suggestions from the beta testers. When I joined I instantly suggested re-writing it in a "real" stack. But when I dived into it, there was a lot of built in features of Bubbl…

People (especially the kind that hangs out in HN) dont seem to understand that there’s a vast ocean of fairly smart people, much smarter than the average (or even above average) programmer, who are unable to build what they can imagine because of the coding bottleneck. I know many, and it’s not for a lack of significant effort that they are not able to learn to code in a way that’s meaningful. I suppose there’s somet…

Totally. I use this analogy where if photoshop did not have this low-code interface and all artists have to do was program strokes code by code, how many artists who couldn't learn or understand "coding" would be left out?

IMO Bubble is only ms-paint+ (entry point lowcode) and Photoshop (or Figma) is yet to hit the market.

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