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Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

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Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#101

Post by atlantis_ »

tomaszs wrote: post #98
zackbloom wrote: post #47

The person writing this is confusing their personal opinion for objective UX fact. It is commonly accepted that only highly organized users use features like tags. The vast majority of people simply don't. Rather than jumping to the conclusion that this is hostile it's possible Chrome and Docs just have a wider user-base than this particular author.

Dave Lynam (the person) is totally correct. Stripping organisational features is against UX.

The belief in the 2010s was that UX design was these pastel-coloured care bears that care deeply about the emotional well-being of people clicking things. And the golden rule was to reduce complexity, while weirdly also hobbling control over what the business logic slurped up.

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#102

Post by browningstreet »

zackbloom wrote: post #47

The person writing this is confusing their personal opinion for objective UX fact. It is commonly accepted that only highly organized users use features like tags. The vast majority of people simply don't. Rather than jumping to the conclusion that this is hostile it's possible Chrome and Docs just have a wider user-base than this particular author.

I wish Youtube (and Youtube Music) had tags. Or at least a way to manage albums. It'd be nice to track "#ListenFromPitchfork" and "#ListenFromTheWire" to albums so I could manage sources.

If not tags, then SOMETHING.

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#103

Post by Tenoke »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #57
Tenoke wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't keep an abandoned project? I use it daily and it doesn't seem to have gotten an update in years (if ever since launch). >It's honestly my only major annoyance about Google Keep. I definitely have more annoyances - it can be slow, it has only minimum features, you can't change the ordering etc.

> it doesn't seem to have gotten an update in years (if ever since launch) That's probably why it doesn't suck as badly as most other Google products. > you can't change the ordering etc. Of notes? Of checkbox items? In both cases: you most definitely can. I just did that, both in the browser and in the app.

>Of notes? Of checkbox items? In both cases: you most definitely can. I just did that, both in the browser and in the app.

You can reorder them one by one but there's no option to then re-order by last edited or created or ascending or anything. Is there?

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#104

Post by DonHopkins »

abxytg wrote: post #18

Google also debuted a new Driving Mode on Google Maps that... entirely changes the UI of of the app and several parts of the phone interface itself. I have never had to look at my phone while driving more in my entire life. It's my fault for using the phone, but it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend as I tried to get google maps to update or display a particular UI. I truly wonder what is going on ove…

You can't use Google Maps on a iPhone held in a bike handlebar mount, because every time you go over a bump, it shakes the phone, and that pops up the damn "Report a data problem" window.

Where's the fucking "Report a user interface problem" window???

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#105

Post by DonHopkins »

threatofrain wrote: post #31
abxytg wrote: post #18

Google also debuted a new Driving Mode on Google Maps that... entirely changes the UI of of the app and several parts of the phone interface itself. I have never had to look at my phone while driving more in my entire life. It's my fault for using the phone, but it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend as I tried to get google maps to update or display a particular UI. I truly wonder what is going on ove…

Apple Maps with the upcoming iOS 15 will also be changing their GUI a bit. I don't think apps should be frozen in time, but at the same time, I'm not sure how it can be updated safely given how human psychology works (people will fiddle with their phones while driving).

Google Maps is Apple Maps Bad!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVq1wgIN62E&ab_channel=Dames...

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#106

Post by wruza »

marcinzm wrote: post #85
EForEndeavour wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The benefit of tags is that a single item can have multiple tags, so you're no longer constrained by having to decide on a specific folder hierarchy to organize them in. You can replace "folders" with tags entirely and still use tags as folders if you want, with the option of storing an item "in multiple folders" (give it multiple tags). Gmail has worked like this for a while: the inbox is just a filter which display…

I suspect it's exactly because GMail supports it. Their data indicates that it's not a user friendly feature for the majority of users (ie: why labels can be nested since 2011) but it's grandfathered into GMail. GMail as I see it began with pure tags, spent a lot of effort trying to get people to use them and then ended up with quasi-folders.

It obviously is not user-friendly when you deprecate folders in favor of tags. That’s the thing which only a software developers mind could dream into reality. When they invent nested labels, it should scream “man that’s folder, folder, damned folder”. But it doesn’t.

Everything is a tag, why not right? They already have: everything is a list, everything is a file, everything is an object, everything is a process. How much “everything is a” failures they need before realizing that these ideas were… obsessions I guess?

Tags are good for tagging, folders are good for hierarchical sorting, colors are good for emphasizing. What’s wrong with having all of them?

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#107

Post by TenJack »

zackbloom wrote: post #47

The person writing this is confusing their personal opinion for objective UX fact. It is commonly accepted that only highly organized users use features like tags. The vast majority of people simply don't. Rather than jumping to the conclusion that this is hostile it's possible Chrome and Docs just have a wider user-base than this particular author.

Not having the ability sort bookmarks by date in the bookmark manager is objectively bad UX for users.

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#108

Post by gweinberg »

EForEndeavour wrote: post #71
gweinberg wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't even think it's about organization, more aesthetic sensibilities. Why would anyone want to have special folder icons? "Because it looks nice" is the only possibility that occurs to me. I probably have over 1000 bookmarks myself, but I can't think of why I would want to "tag" a bookmark. Tags can be useful for finding new content, but if I bookmark a sit I probably know enough about it that I wouldn;t benefit…

The benefit of tags is that a single item can have multiple tags, so you're no longer constrained by having to decide on a specific folder hierarchy to organize them in. You can replace "folders" with tags entirely and still use tags as folders if you want, with the option of storing an item "in multiple folders" (give it multiple tags). Gmail has worked like this for a while: the inbox is just a filter which display…

I accomplish this by butting the same bookmark in multiple folders. In my file structure I do this with symlinks, but a bookmark is pretty much just a link anyway.A tag is pretty much the same as just a parallel folder, right?

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#109

Post by yupper32 »

abxytg wrote: post #77
yupper32 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"it" did not very nearly cause 2 accidents. They're trying to avoid some of the blame, as if they're not 100% at fault.

> It's my fault for using the phone I do take the blame. I'm driving somewhere 6 hours away that I've never been with a dog in the car. Normally it's quite safe for me to do things like manage turn by turn navigation, and pick up a hands free call, or pause an audiobook, or ask the phone to reroute me to food, gas, or a rest stop. If you are able to drive solo 6 hours to a new place in total silence without stopping…

You're still avoiding taking all the blame by making excuses and being super defensive. You know damn well sitting in total silence was not my suggestion.

I am also able to manage those things without taking my eyes off the road for more than I would looking at my speedometer. If there's a new UI that's new and different, you should have pulled over to figure it out instead of almost crashing not once, but twice.

Re: Why Google's bookmark manager and Docs have purposefully bad UI

#110

Post by neither_color »

abxytg wrote: post #18

Google also debuted a new Driving Mode on Google Maps that... entirely changes the UI of of the app and several parts of the phone interface itself. I have never had to look at my phone while driving more in my entire life. It's my fault for using the phone, but it very nearly caused 2 accidents for me this weekend as I tried to get google maps to update or display a particular UI. I truly wonder what is going on ove…

Apple watch fixed this for me entirely. I just have to glance down at my wrist that's already on my steering wheel, and read a simple one-line instruction that takes milliseconds for my brain to parse "in 500 feet turn right on [Street]." It's also great for walking around sketchy neighborhoods, so I dont need to have my phone out.
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