Google “bought off Samsung” to limit app store competition, 36 states allege • Hacker News Board

Re: Google “bought off Samsung” to limit app store competition, 36 states allege

#101

Post by Fnoord » Sat, Jul 10, 2021, 1:19 AM UTC

GavinMcG wrote: post #77

wayneftw wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bad design choice is exactly what a design flaw is though. There's no other definition. If you make bad choices, that's a flaw in your design. End users have to live with these choices, so we get to decide what is a flaw and what is not. Focusing on thin instead of useful is a design flaw. Requiring dongles for everything is a design flaw.

"Flawed" does not simply mean "bad". It means "defective" or "broken" or "blemished" or the like. A poor design is merely unappealing to certain consumers. A flawed design fails to fully function in the manner intended.

Ah yeah, "certain users". These "certain users" who like to charge their laptop while using one peripheral. These "certain users" who use a USB hub on their only USB port. Come on. Its a flat out downgrade to what was possible in the past. We all know why they made the terrible design choice. Upselling to a non-broken device. They do the same with GB storage on their iDevices. And, all of their devices had design flaws.

Re: Google “bought off Samsung” to limit app store competition, 36 states allege

#102

Post by Fnoord » Sat, Jul 10, 2021, 1:31 AM UTC

madmax96 wrote: post #74

salamandersauce wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's been other issues. MacBook Pros have had issues with the screen ribbon cable causing problems with the backlight (a.k.a Flexgate). Then there's been issues with batteries swelling in 2015 MBPs which impacts the trackpad too. Plus there has been countless models with GPU failures being commonplace stretching allll the way back to to iBook G3. I would personally consider the 2018 Mac Mini to have a design flaw…

Do you still use Apple laptops? If not what do you use? Are Apple laptops higher quality, compared to competitors (despite design issues)? My current Macbook had the screen laminate peel off after a few years. To Apple's credit, they promptly repaired the machine at no cost. But I've had friends with similarly priced laptops (XPS, Razor, ...) who encountered similar build-quality issues, but did not receive the same…

I replaced two of these screens (MBP 2015 13" and 15") under the program (ie. for free), but they refused to fix a MBP 2014 13" for free. It'd cost me 600 EUR to repair. This was in 2018. At some point they start the repair program, and some point they stop it, and IIRC the limit was 4 years for consumers here in NL. I keep using these machines (replaced some hardware on it such as keyboard, battery, screws, and my wife uses one too), though they each got their flaws. I'd consider a M1 (but my boss ain't buying me one :). Mac is still a superb UI and workflow with Unix under the hood. I think the later models are even worse for gaming, with the ones before M1 you could maybe use TB + eGPU. I just stick to a Linux machine for gaming, with Steam, all kind of emulators, and Wine.

Re: Google “bought off Samsung” to limit app store competition, 36 states allege

#103

Post by madmax96 » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 1:22 AM UTC

salamandersauce wrote: post #75

madmax96 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you still use Apple laptops? If not what do you use? Are Apple laptops higher quality, compared to competitors (despite design issues)? My current Macbook had the screen laminate peel off after a few years. To Apple's credit, they promptly repaired the machine at no cost. But I've had friends with similarly priced laptops (XPS, Razor, ...) who encountered similar build-quality issues, but did not receive the same…

I currently use a 2018 MBP still. I didn't personally pay for it so I don't think I could just get rid of it. Next time I think I'll go back to a Thinkpad. I don't feel like Macbooks are higher quality for the price than a comparably priced Windows laptop with some exception. Gaming laptops tend to cut build quality corners to give more specs for the money basically. And did you have Applecare when they repaired your…

I did not have AppleCare. Sorry to hear about your iPad Pro keyboard issues.

Re: Google “bought off Samsung” to limit app store competition, 36 states allege

#104

Post by melq » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 12:00 PM UTC

wayneftw wrote: post #62

GavinMcG wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aside from the keyboard issues, you're talking about design choices you don't like , not design flaws . They made the choices they made, and by and large executed on them at a high degree of quality.

A bad design choice is exactly what a design flaw is though. There's no other definition. If you make bad choices, that's a flaw in your design. End users have to live with these choices, so we get to decide what is a flaw and what is not. Focusing on thin instead of useful is a design flaw. Requiring dongles for everything is a design flaw.

You don't seem to understand the difference between a design choice you don't like, versus an objectively bad design.

When Apple removed the headphone jack from iPhones, (supposedly) in favor of making them waterproof, that was a design choice that many people rightfully disliked. However, we can imagine there was also a population of people who preferred such a tradeoff. For instance: lifeguards, sea-world trainers, deaf people. It's not a 'flaw' simply because you don't prefer it.

If you are someone who buys a diving watch, but isn't a deep sea diver, you aren't justified in complaining that the watch isn't solar powered. There are people who require (or at least prefer) such a watch, and if you aren't among them, don't buy it.

You don't get to decide what is and isn't a flaw based on your arbitrary use cases. An actual flaw is an implementation detail that is not consistent with the design specs. If Apple set out to make a phone with a working headphone jack, and the resulting product didn't have one, thats a flaw. If they set out to make a phone without a headphone jack, then it isn't a design flaw if the resulting phone doesn't have one.

Re: Google “bought off Samsung” to limit app store competition, 36 states allege

#105

Post by wayneftw » Wed, Jul 14, 2021, 12:47 PM UTC

melq wrote: post #104

wayneftw wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bad design choice is exactly what a design flaw is though. There's no other definition. If you make bad choices, that's a flaw in your design. End users have to live with these choices, so we get to decide what is a flaw and what is not. Focusing on thin instead of useful is a design flaw. Requiring dongles for everything is a design flaw.

You don't seem to understand the difference between a design choice you don't like, versus an objectively bad design. When Apple removed the headphone jack from iPhones, (supposedly) in favor of making them waterproof, that was a design choice that many people rightfully disliked. However, we can imagine there was also a population of people who preferred such a tradeoff. For instance: lifeguards, sea-world trainers,…

You don't seem to understand that there is no arbiter of objectivity that we can rely on and that deciding what is a flawed design and what is not is completely subjective.

Removing the headphone jack "for waterproofing" is obviously defective for me because other phones that are waterproof didn't have to remove the jack and I had to buy new headphones. It wasn't for Apple though - they designed it that way so they could sell more headphones. That's how subjectivity works.

Who complained about deep sea watches not being solar powered? I don't have to make up situations to prove my point like a weasel. I just point them out as I see them and the examples I've referenced have been widely held as flaws in Apple's designs.

I do get to decide what is a flaw based on intended use cases as stated by Apple. Nobody made up any arbitrary use cases here.