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Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

novaramedia.com

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Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#101

Post by edwr »

kragen wrote: post #89
barefootcoder wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get a bit frustrated whenever a Google search for some how-to item leads to a YouTube video leaving me thinking "this should have just been text with some pictures", but I've come to the conclusion that it's all about the money -- content creators get paid more for video content, even if it's 80% "like and subscribe and listen to me ramble" overhead, and there just isn't a good place to host well-written howto cont…

I think it's that Google is better at filtering out spam on YouTube.

I think they have greater incentives for filtering out spam on YouTube.

Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#102

Post by skluug »

sampo wrote: post #50
skluug wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In addition, all articles should have an audio option as well. I unfortunately just don't have the attention span to read walls of text, but put in audio format and I have no problem.

> all articles should have an audio option as well Isn't there a variety of text-to-speech apps available?

Sure, but they're not great. (I think there's also a variety of speech-to-text apps?)

Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#103

Post by [deleted] »

agumonkey wrote: post #99
bumby wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The pace is certainly different but I’ve found most engineers lose those skills that aren’t directly relevant to their job at hand. Ask that power plant engineer to do fluid dynamics and they’d likely be lost. The physical engineering disciplines are often hyper-specialized as well

Sure you forget but if you come into a fluid dynamic problem, you know that the universe didn't move to a new paradigm, I assume it's a different feeling to know that you can revisit the knowledge instead of navigating a totally new structure.

[deleted]

Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#104

Post by bumby »

agumonkey wrote: post #99
bumby wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The pace is certainly different but I’ve found most engineers lose those skills that aren’t directly relevant to their job at hand. Ask that power plant engineer to do fluid dynamics and they’d likely be lost. The physical engineering disciplines are often hyper-specialized as well

Sure you forget but if you come into a fluid dynamic problem, you know that the universe didn't move to a new paradigm, I assume it's a different feeling to know that you can revisit the knowledge instead of navigating a totally new structure.

Do you feel the fundamental precepts of programming don’t generally hold true regardless of the application of the technology?

Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#105

Post by pedrosorio »

busterarm wrote: post #86
pedrosorio wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm working with a few hundred backend engineers who all have a hard time with thinking infrastructure is always available and can handle infinite throughput. Could you clarify this statement? Are you saying you work with hundreds of backend engineers: - who all believe infra is always available and can handle infinite throughput (???) or - who can't wrap their head around an environment where infra is so scalable…

You don't have to look hard to find stories of people running up huge cloud infrastructure bills by using it improperly. Engineers in general poorly understand the connection between their code and resources consumed. Until something bites them and they learn. I'd say that this is pretty widespread throughout the industry.

I know there are plenty of engineers with those gaps, and they learn from experience, as one does.

My issue was with the statement that all backend engineers you work with (hundreds of them!) have this weakness. Does not match my experience, so I was wondering where you work.

Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#106

Post by antonvs »

IAmWorried wrote: post #6

Beside the point, but IMO, all podcasts should have a transcription option as well. I unfortunately just don't have the attention span to listen to hours of people talking, but put it in text format and I have zero issues.

It's not just attention span, but time. It's hugely inefficient, and there are usually better things to devote one's time to.

Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#107

Post by antonvs »

Pfhreak wrote: post #66
Pfhreak wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm not against technology Neither were the Luddites! The Luddites were a labor movement who wanted to ensure that workers in textile mills were being treated fairly. Many Luddites were highly skilled and happy to work with automated looms, they just didn't want factories to fire all the skilled labor and pay pennies on the dollar to unskilled labor. (While holding cloth prices steady.)

Also, as a separate comment, the day will come where software development is automated in some capacity. All the high skill workers may be competing with workers with much less training at lower wages. The Luddites are a good cautionary tale about when you should protect your working conditions and rights (when the demand for your services is at its peak). So many engineers I talk to these days say things like, "Why…

> The Luddites are a good cautionary tale about when you should protect your working conditions and rights

But at that point, you'd be doing exactly what the Luddites were doing, which was attempting to hold back the natural consequences of technological advancement.

The (temporary) end state of that kind of thing are artificially inefficient situations where someone is paid an unreasonably well to do something that could be done much more efficiently by a machine.

That's a temporary end state because at some point, the people and organizations doing that will be definitively out-competed, and that particular instance of Luddism becomes another historical footnote.

Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#108

Post by antonvs »

Pfhreak wrote: post #74
ChrisLomont wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luddites destroyed machinery because the new technology was threatening to replace them. They were most certainly against this technology. Fortunately, the explosion of affordable textiles resulted in many more jobs in textiles, which were unskilled. So the luddites were right - they were not worth the cost of their skilled labor. They did get replaced. But society as a whole gained a lot, as is usual for new technol…

> They were most certainly against this technology. Absolutely not. They were absolutely willing to operate the machinery. They could have produced more cloth at the same price, or distributed more of the earnings back to the workers. It's not a boolean outcome where it's either "the machines or the Luddites". There are plenty of ways to solve the problems they raised without doing away with either.

> They were absolutely willing to operate the machinery.

Smashing the machines was perhaps a poor way to communicate that.

And how far do you take that? There have literally been union jobs where someone's shift consisted of doing nothing but pressing a button every now and then. That's a pointless waste of both human life and economic efficiency.

Someone else in this thread wrote:

> a Luddite opposes the automation of labor without a plan to support the displaced laborers

...which seems like a much more viable position, although perhaps not so popular in the US.

Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#109

Post by kragen »

edwr wrote: post #101
kragen wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's that Google is better at filtering out spam on YouTube.

I think they have greater incentives for filtering out spam on YouTube.

Yes, and also the cost of posting spam to YouTube is higher.

Re: Are Hackers the New Luddites? [audio]

#110

Post by agumonkey »

bumby wrote: post #104
agumonkey wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure you forget but if you come into a fluid dynamic problem, you know that the universe didn't move to a new paradigm, I assume it's a different feeling to know that you can revisit the knowledge instead of navigating a totally new structure.

Do you feel the fundamental precepts of programming don’t generally hold true regardless of the application of the technology?

if you spend your days design algorithms yeah but if you assemble vue or angular components I think it's much different.
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