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In Stockholm there's currently an IT battle underway

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Re: In Stockholm there's currently an IT battle underway

#101

Post by jordanbeiber »

stale2002 wrote: post #99
jordanbeiber wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Big companies are often horribly inefficient. A decent democratic government at least over here in Scandinavia, try to make life on average as good as possible for the majority. Funny you should mention pensions... Govt probably knows many or even most regular people are completely uninterested in pensions and/or “the market”. Many could need help or even be forced to set away money they otherwise wouldn’t. This is w…

> A decent democratic government at least over here in Scandinavia, try to make life on average as good as possible for the majority. Well, the government solution doesn't seem to be working out so well for this app that is being built.

No, but it’s not a ”government” problem per se, is what I’m saying.

I stated this to highlight the difference in goals of a democratic government and a private company - seeing as pensions got mentioned.

It is a ”governance” org type problem, sure, but this is prevalent in any big company.

Still sucks though.

Re: In Stockholm there's currently an IT battle underway

#103

Post by stale2002 »

bsder wrote: post #25
lucb1e wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Proprietary route: input: 5+ years and 100 million dollars output: crappy system maintenance: still necessary, hire anyone but probably the expensive guys from before The route that these parents demonstrated: input: a few months and presumably a whole lot less money output: something that seems to be well-liked maintenance: still necessary, hire anyone Regardless of "but who's going to maintain it", the benefits sho…

> Regardless of "but who's going to maintain it", the benefits should be clear here. Are they clear? Or is this the "Chrysler Comprehensive Compensation System" all over again? aka the gigantic disaster that somehow spawned the Extreme Programming "experts" and implemented the easy 80% while missing the really hard 80% (yes, that totals to 160% intentionally). It's really easy to produce something that majority like…

> Are they clear?

Yes they are. The benefits are clear, because apparently a whole bunch of users got together a spent a bunch of effort building something that solve real problems that they themselves were having.

> everybody always simply gives the open source project the benefit of the doubt at being "better" when it probably just blows off a lot of functionality.

If people are using it, and spent a bunch of time and effort to solve their problems, then almost by definition, it is solving a problem that they were having.

So yes, we can just assume that it is better in some ways. If a bunch of people are using it, then almost by definition, it is providing value to some people.

Re: In Stockholm there's currently an IT battle underway

#104

Post by stale2002 »

jordanbeiber wrote: post #101
stale2002 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A decent democratic government at least over here in Scandinavia, try to make life on average as good as possible for the majority. Well, the government solution doesn't seem to be working out so well for this app that is being built.

No, but it’s not a ”government” problem per se, is what I’m saying. I stated this to highlight the difference in goals of a democratic government and a private company - seeing as pensions got mentioned. It is a ”governance” org type problem, sure, but this is prevalent in any big company. Still sucks though.

> but it’s not a ”government” problem per se

Sure it is. Because the non government solution is apparently working a lot better in this specific circumstance.

So yes, the blame falls squarely on the government for this specific situation.

Re: In Stockholm there's currently an IT battle underway

#106

Post by hutzlibu »

juskrey wrote: post #100
hutzlibu wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or why not execute them instead? Worked very well for ages ... More seriously, there usually are no simple solutions to complex problems. And government is a very complex problem. So many people with so many opinions - and everyone involved afraid to say one wrong word or make one wrong decision. I don't think more fear helps there. I mean - prison for corruption - yes! But prison for incompetence, no. Then you also…

Just take back the salary when the city is net negative from their "experiments"

Yeah, but would you like to have your salary reclaimed later on, if they are not satisfied with your work?

Could you do calmy your job then? Or would the anxiety made you even more prone to misstakes?

Re: In Stockholm there's currently an IT battle underway

#107

Post by jordanbeiber »

stale2002 wrote: post #104
jordanbeiber wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, but it’s not a ”government” problem per se, is what I’m saying. I stated this to highlight the difference in goals of a democratic government and a private company - seeing as pensions got mentioned. It is a ”governance” org type problem, sure, but this is prevalent in any big company. Still sucks though.

> but it’s not a ”government” problem per se Sure it is. Because the non government solution is apparently working a lot better in this specific circumstance. So yes, the blame falls squarely on the government for this specific situation.

Not sure you’ve set foot at big co IT departments?

This is a “project as delivery & governance model” issue.

We can blame them for using such a model, yes, but the situation is not much better at most non-tech companies of moderate size.

Re: In Stockholm there's currently an IT battle underway

#108

Post by toyg »

RupertEisenhart wrote: post #86
urvader wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We did. We have a regex to catch all variants of spellings. But since our code is open they can easily select another variant. We could load our script dynamically but have chosen not to of security reasons. (And transparency). (I’m the founder of this initiative)

Can't you ban the malicious Devs? They keep creating new GitHub accounts or what?

Not OP but from what I understand, the problem is that their code has to interoperate with the “private” service run by the “bad guys”; it’s basically a more usable front-end. So the bad guys keep messing with the backend just to break the open client.

Re: In Stockholm there's currently an IT battle underway

#109

Post by dromtrund »

RupertEisenhart wrote: post #86
urvader wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We did. We have a regex to catch all variants of spellings. But since our code is open they can easily select another variant. We could load our script dynamically but have chosen not to of security reasons. (And transparency). (I’m the founder of this initiative)

Can't you ban the malicious Devs? They keep creating new GitHub accounts or what?

I assume they read the code that tries to parse the data, and come up with formats that don't fit. If the code is open, they don't need accounts to see it

Re: In Stockholm there's currently an IT battle underway

#110

Post by tsimionescu »

RupertEisenhart wrote: post #86
urvader wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We did. We have a regex to catch all variants of spellings. But since our code is open they can easily select another variant. We could load our script dynamically but have chosen not to of security reasons. (And transparency). (I’m the founder of this initiative)

Can't you ban the malicious Devs? They keep creating new GitHub accounts or what?

The government devs are deliberately modifying server code after seeing what the open source code is using to identify their header. Guthub doesn't require an account to view code, so how could they ban government coders from seeing their code?
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