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Vue Native (2018)

vue-native.io

101–110 of 190 posts

Re: Vue Native (2018)

#101
post #88

Is anyone else sad that we have adopted HTML/CSS as the universal lingua franca for describing views? I understand why (or at least I believe I do): HTML/CSS is an inevitable part of the ecosystem because the web is an important target. A lot of devs will know at least some, and your organisation may already have loads of them because you also need to target the web. Maybe you even already have some view code written…

> The problem is that it's bad. I say this as someone who comes from the outside, and isn't an expert ("barely competent" in HTML/CSS is probably accurate). Basic layout of things in a way that copes with different screen sizes/orientations is a surprisingly black art sometimes. There's a lot of history confusing the issue and three ways of doing each thing. How can you say this with a "barely competent" level of exp…

> How can you say this with a "barely competent" level of expertise?

I get that, and that's why I declared it. I have two reasons why I think the opinion is still valid:

I'm not completely incompetent. I have produced useful web frontend work. After having spent more time on web technologies than a lot of others I still find it to be slower and harder. This point is about learning - I have done some learning in both and I can compare. It's a small sample size, but seems to agree with the experience of other people.

The other point is that most people talking about this are already experts in HTML/CSS. That learning is a sunk cost for them so they're not making fair comparisons. I also sometimes feel like there's a little 'Stockholm syndrome' - they've invested time and effort in learning the techniques and tools required to produce good quality web UI, and now that they can they overlook the effort required to get to that point and proclaim the wonderful nature of what they're using.

The sunk cost thing is the important aspect. I'm not even saying that it's wrong that it's become the standard UI description language - it as at least an open specified standard. I'm just saying that not enough attention is paid to the downsides.

Re: Vue Native (2018)

#102
post #90
post #88

Is anyone else sad that we have adopted HTML/CSS as the universal lingua franca for describing views? I understand why (or at least I believe I do): HTML/CSS is an inevitable part of the ecosystem because the web is an important target. A lot of devs will know at least some, and your organisation may already have loads of them because you also need to target the web. Maybe you even already have some view code written…

Just like JavaScript: it's bad but it is the only thing that works everywhere so it's won.

Modern JavaScript is pretty good.

Re: Vue Native (2018)

#103
I use to frown upon cross-platform js solutions until I built a cross platform app. While the initial app building part was no problem, packaging them for various platforms (macos, windows) was pure h*l.

Re: Vue Native (2018)

#104
Yeah I dunno, react native is a neat idea, in practice it was all pain all the time. Updating, debugging, building, ensuring it worked on all devices, then add in something like Bluetooth LE and the pain grew even more.

Would have been easier to create two apps in their native platforms.

Re: Vue Native (2018)

#105
post #93
post #88

Is anyone else sad that we have adopted HTML/CSS as the universal lingua franca for describing views? I understand why (or at least I believe I do): HTML/CSS is an inevitable part of the ecosystem because the web is an important target. A lot of devs will know at least some, and your organisation may already have loads of them because you also need to target the web. Maybe you even already have some view code written…

I just don't understand what happened to classical RAD from the late 90s early 00s. OK web was out of touch because no one really uses the "standard gui" anymore, even something as simple as a button has different look and behavior on every website. But mobile app should be prime targets for it, and theming is a well understood concept for it too. So why do we not have a proper rad tool (drag and drop my button where…

One problem is that in larger teams, text descriptions that play nicely with version control are much easier to manage. You can review changes, you can share code etc.

It's not dead though - C# development still has Visual Studio and it can be pretty good.

Re: Vue Native (2018)

#106
post #95
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you elaborate? Undo/redo in what contexts? What applications had undo/redo besides for editing things?

Is "editing things" (i.e. data) not central in the majority of apps?

Sure, but the text editor does have undo.

Re: Vue Native (2018)

#107
post #88

Is anyone else sad that we have adopted HTML/CSS as the universal lingua franca for describing views? I understand why (or at least I believe I do): HTML/CSS is an inevitable part of the ecosystem because the web is an important target. A lot of devs will know at least some, and your organisation may already have loads of them because you also need to target the web. Maybe you even already have some view code written…

> The problem is that it's bad. I say this as someone who comes from the outside, and isn't an expert ("barely competent" in HTML/CSS is probably accurate). Basic layout of things in a way that copes with different screen sizes/orientations is a surprisingly black art sometimes. There's a lot of history confusing the issue and three ways of doing each thing. How can you say this with a "barely competent" level of exp…

Because of backwards compatibility, HTML+CSS makes it cumbersome to use the simplest ways to layout things. And it's also confusing because the oldest ways are still very much valid. You have to make divs (or semantic equivalents that I'm not sure are used anymore), and then mark them as different kinds of displays using CSS, with multiple sublanguages for multiple properties.

Compare that to QML Quick Layouts[1], GTK containers [2] or winui controls [3] where you just instantiate whatever kind of display with the container you want in a single model using qml/GTK Builder XML/XAML and be done with it.

[1] https://doc.qt.io/qt-5/qtquicklayouts-index.html

[2] https://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/stable/GtkContainer.html#Gt...

[3] https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/winui/api/microsoft...

Re: Vue Native (2018)

#108
To be honest, I don't see any reason not to use Flutter if you want to make a cross-platform app these days. Any other cross-platform framework I tried seemed somehow lacking, slow, unpleasant to use etc.

Re: Vue Native (2018)

#109
post #88

Is anyone else sad that we have adopted HTML/CSS as the universal lingua franca for describing views? I understand why (or at least I believe I do): HTML/CSS is an inevitable part of the ecosystem because the web is an important target. A lot of devs will know at least some, and your organisation may already have loads of them because you also need to target the web. Maybe you even already have some view code written…

Yes, we need GUI abstractions that compile to HTML/CSS and native platforms, not doing it the other way around.
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