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California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

leginfo.legislature.ca.gov

101–110 of 663 posts

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#101
post #15

always entertaining how regulation unintentionally acts to increase barriers to entry for incumbents. in this case closing the barn doors almost a decade after the horse left the stable. you couldn't pay politicians enough for the favors they perform in earnest. edit:to elaborate, the growth hacks of the likes of Doordash and Postmates doing exactly this got them their start, now it will be illegal to compete with th…

What do you mean? In this case small businesses were being abused by delivery apps. Once these apps captured the customers of the small business, they converted the customers to their alternative offering restaurant. This is a good piece of legislature unless I am missing something.

How were businesses being abused?

Do you mean customers use the app to order from X-Pizza, the app then prominently lists Y-Pizza and now X loses customers?

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#102

If a person decides to buy a pizza from X and then sell it to Y, don't they have a right to?

Not if you're using X branding to market the pizza to Y.

Especially, not if the pizza being resold doesn't live up to X quality standards because it got cold.

Try reselling from any major fast food restaurant, they'll stop selling to you, and if you paid different people to do the pickup, I bet you would get sued.

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#103
post #9

This is a silly law. If someone feels like sending a courier to buy take away then that should be legal.

Say you're the restaurant, I'm the delivery guy. I pickup your meals and deliver them to your customers. On the way the meals go cold (or hot) and get damaged. Your customers aren't happy and want their money back. My actions have made your service look bad, your customers unhappy and cost you money. You didn't know I was delivering your food!

Isn't this exactly the kind of thing trademark laws is supposed to cover?

I'm pretty sure that if you tried to resell food at scale from a major fast food franchise without proper licensing, you would get sued.

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#104

There was a post a few months go about a pizza place that started getting customers complaining about their food arriving cold and damaged: except they didn't offer delivery. They discovered that a popular search engine was offering free delivery. The story ended with them ordering dozens of pizzas from themselves to themselves and making a nice profit.

lol. That's nice. I can see from the trademark point of view, it makes sense to stop other people from listing your business in their list, brands should be protected. But providing a service for customer should be legal. It would be the same as Taxi drivers should be able to pick you up from your home to a business without the permission of the business.

But I bet I can’t start a taxi service and call it Uber Shuttle Service for job applicants and build a website with Uber logo, phone number, and everything and when job applicants call me I pretend to be Uber?

Hey why stop there? maybe I can ask the job applicants for their personal information letting them believe they are talking to Uber and if they look like good candidates, I can build a website with information I gathered from them and start my own employment agency, call it quadruple bites or something and then call FAANG companies and offer to place candidates...

I think a big part of the problem is the misrepresentation/false advertising.

However, the goal I think is more sinister. For example, I believe Walmart decides how much it wants to pay suppliers who want to have their stuff sold at Walmart. If a delivery app is big enough, it can dictate the prices and terms of sale with a restaurant and demand deep discounts and forbid restaurants from making the deal public. The challenge is how does a delivery app become big enough to do that? Feels like a chicken and egg problem.

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#105
This is undeniably a good thing if you put yourself in the shoes of the restaurant.

Imagine if someone went around impersonating your business online, leveraging the good name you have built for yourself over the decades. They create ads offering your expert development services, ostensibly competing with your existing website, but with intentionally slashed pricing and a ‘creatively’ misrepresented offering (aka growth hacking). Then they subcontract the job to some crappy outsourcing firm that bungles it, but who cares, they got their cut and you signed the TOS.

Now bad reviews are piling up online about the bad experiences people had with your business, your reputation is destroyed, and your business is next.

I know it’s not a perfect analogy but try to empathize with the restaurants here.

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#106
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can't take orders on behalf of others This law does not say that at all. It's completely silent on whether the platform can take orders. It prohibits a single specific action, and that action is arranging for the delivery of an order. > you can freely arrange for someone in an app to "make an order" for you and then fetch the meal. You can arrange for them to make an order if you want to. That's allowed. But "f…

The text that has been quoted all over this thread does say "to take orders and deliver meals" . Sure it could be better worded, but it seems that the intent here is quite clear: to stop the practice that was being done by DoorDash/Postmates.

Look at how the law is formulated: "A food delivery platform shall not X without Y."

X is the action the law allows or prohibits.

Y decides whether the action is allowed or not.

If "authorization to take orders and deliver meals" exists, then they can deliver. If "authorization to take orders and deliver meals" does not exist, then they cannot deliver.

"take orders" does not appear in the law anywhere else. It's only in the phrase "authorization to take orders", and in that context the law is only checking if that authorization exists. This particular law does not say when taking orders is allowed or prohibited. This law does not care if a platform is taking orders. It cares about whether the platform delivers, and it cares about whether the platform has "authorization to take orders and deliver meals".

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Edit: Pretend for a second the law said "A food delivery platform shall not arrange for the delivery of an order from a food facility without first obtaining an agreement with the food facility expressly authorizing the food delivery platform to own puppies and deliver meals prepared by the food facility."

Would that law have any effect on whether the food delivery platform can own puppies? Nah. The restaurant has to say "you are allowed to own puppies" before the platform can deliver, but that law is not imbuing the puppy clause with any other power. It neither allows nor disallows actual puppy ownership.

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So my main point is not that a platform should get cheeky by trying to take orders but not deliver, or something.

It's that even if they're not taking orders, this law blocks them from delivering. If they don't have the authorization, they can't deliver, end of story. The restaurant didn't say they can have a puppy, so they can't deliver, and it doesn't matter whether there actually is a puppy.

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#107
post #15

always entertaining how regulation unintentionally acts to increase barriers to entry for incumbents. in this case closing the barn doors almost a decade after the horse left the stable. you couldn't pay politicians enough for the favors they perform in earnest. edit:to elaborate, the growth hacks of the likes of Doordash and Postmates doing exactly this got them their start, now it will be illegal to compete with th…

> Doordash and Postmates doing exactly this got them their start, now it will be illegal to compete with them using the same methods they used.

Waiting for a company with even worse practices, to be able to compete most effectively, doesn't seem like a net win.

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#108

This is undeniably a good thing if you put yourself in the shoes of the restaurant. Imagine if someone went around impersonating your business online, leveraging the good name you have built for yourself over the decades. They create ads offering your expert development services, ostensibly competing with your existing website, but with intentionally slashed pricing and a ‘creatively’ misrepresented offering (aka gro…

This exact thing is happening to one of my favorite local pizza places. Very frustrating for them.

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#109

This is undeniably a good thing if you put yourself in the shoes of the restaurant. Imagine if someone went around impersonating your business online, leveraging the good name you have built for yourself over the decades. They create ads offering your expert development services, ostensibly competing with your existing website, but with intentionally slashed pricing and a ‘creatively’ misrepresented offering (aka gro…

Why does that require anything other than enforcement of existing trademark law?

Re: California law bans delivery apps from listing a restaurant without an agreement

#110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, hence, impersonation

The issue here isn't "did delivery apps sometimes impersonate restaurants" (which is why you think this law is redundant), but rather "does this law ban things other than impersonation" (yes, and hence why others are saying a violation of the law need not constitute impersonation).

The point is that the stated reason for the law is impersonation, which is already illegal, but under the guise of cracking down on impersonation of restaurants, the law does much more.
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