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Winning back the Internet by building our own

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Re: Winning back the Internet by building our own

#101

Post by tptacek »

jcranmer wrote: post #63
lazyjones wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are resorting to cussing, you criticise that Trump is exercising his constitutionally granted right to sue when in his opinion he has been wronged and you openly admit ignorance and unwillingness to educate yourself about issues you pretend to be interested in. Why do you believe your thus uttered opinions would change someone's mind (at least in the direction you would agree with), or, at least lead to an intere…

> you criticise that Trump is exercising his constitutionally granted right to sue when in his opinion he has been wronged Having actually read some of those suits, I would say you could make a case that Giuliani should be disbarred. These suits are cases where the Trump campaign usually has no standing, the claims are often not even proper allegations, the remedies sought are literally unprecedented, and often even…

You know this, I'm sure, but you don't even really have that; the Case or Controversy clause says you only get to sue if you can state a harm to yourself that has actually happened and a remedy the court can realistically and legally apply. The rules of standing are what prevents the Supreme Court from being a panel of philosopher-kings.

Re: Winning back the Internet by building our own

#102

Post by mackrevinack »

Hnrobert42 wrote: post #47

Discussing torrents: > people were more easily able to access the things they needed without being forced to ask or pay for permission to have them. Haha. We’re not talking about folks stealing bread to feed their family. We’re talking about people stealing entertainment. There’s a lot wrong with big media corporations: DMCA takedown notice misuse, copyright for life of the artist + 75 years, exploitative contracts,…

I downloaded guardians of the galaxy recently because someone was praising the cgi and I just wanted a quick look at it, but there is no way I would go to the cinema to watch it and no way I would ever buy it on dvd even if it was being sold really cheap. basically they would not make any money from me either way, so what exactly is being stolen from them?

Re: Winning back the Internet by building our own

#103

Post by mackrevinack »

cortesoft wrote: post #8

This article basically describes how the current internet was created.... why would this new internet end up any different? You can't expect every person to be skilled enough (and with the time and desire) to be their own network administrator, so someone will have to run the network for those people... and they will need to be compensated for that work... and some people will be really good at running that network,…

the safe network is going to be autonomous so it won't even need anyone to act as an admin. all you will need to do is log in to access your files

https://safenetwork.tech

Re: Winning back the Internet by building our own

#105

Post by DoreenMichele »

xpe wrote: post #83
DoreenMichele wrote: post #25

It's not just that corporations own a lot of the physical infrastructure. Another factor is that humans as a group tend to force other humans to commercialize what they do, even if they expressly don't want to do that and would rather publish it without ads, without paywalls, without subscriptions, etc. We do a poor job of making it possible for people who create open source and people who create free content to get…

> Another factor is that humans as a group tend to force other humans to commercialize what they do, even if they expressly don't want to do that and would rather publish it without ads, without paywalls, without subscriptions, etc. You've strained the meaning of the word 'force'. Can you find another way to say it?

I don't think I have. I don't think I have because I was literally homeless for years (and frequently too broke to eat) while trying to figure out how to get money for my writing and being told by people "Writing doesn't pay. Get a real job." while my writing hit the front page of HN sometimes and I was quite open about my medical situation and other factors that prevented me from finding some other way to support myself.

I have a really extreme set of circumstances that have not given me some easy way out of continuing to try to get money for my writing in specific. If I had some easy out, I would have taken it ages ago.

I did apply for a job -- the only one I tripped across that I felt qualified for. I didn't get it. I also do resume work and can't figure out how to get adequate traction with that either. etc etc.

I've tried to find other answers. What little money I make for blogging has proven to be the least worst answer for me so far.

If the entire world literally will let you starve and be homeless rather than give you money for work it values and praises that has no pay wall, I don't think it's straining the meaning of the word 'force' to say that will force some people to give up on their ideals and figure out something that keeps them fed and housed -- if they have any means to do that.

Re: Winning back the Internet by building our own

#106

Post by Maakuth »

rmrfstar wrote: post #94
dnautics wrote: post #78

Perhaps this is self-serving of me, since I want to build a product like this, but: I think honestly the problem is that these systems are not consumer-oriented products. I think there is a real desire by people to not have to live as rentiers in the digital marketplace, but there are not really products that cater to that. IMO There's a place for something that merges a NAS, with some sort of overlay over current IP…

If I was going to do this in a weekend, I would avoid the NAS device. "The ecosystem is moving", availability, etc. Build a simple system around "content groups", something that people will put in the same mental category as "group chats". Each "content group" has a LUKS encrypted filesystem somewhere in the cloud. Keys are exchanged using Megolm and Matrix rooms. The filesystems are mounted via sshfs and decrypted l…

I mostly like your idea, but filesystems are probably the wrong abstraction for this - concurrency when writes are ongoing is difficult and corruption will likely result. How about something like S3, overlaid with rclone's encryption: https://rclone.org/crypt? The rest of the system could work like you described, exchanging keys via Matrix.

Re: Winning back the Internet by building our own

#107

Post by anhner »

cocktailpeanuts wrote: post #70
dnautics wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> watching movies and show you didn’t pay for is theft When I have a bike and you steal it from me, you are depriving me of the use of that bicycle. That's what makes it theft. There is no deprival, therefore no theft in "watching something you didn't pay for". If you argue "you are depriving the right of the artist to make money" that makes the assumption that the right of an artist to coerce money out of the counte…

> When I have a bike and you steal it from me, you are depriving me of the use of that bicycle. That's what makes it theft. Let me give you back your analogy with a dose of reality: When I make a living by selling bikes, and you steal it from me, you are depriving me of my time and energy and money spent to maintain my business. That's what makes it theft.

If you make a living selling bikes, and I make an exact copy of your bike WITHOUT taking the one you have just made, am I still stealing from you?

Re: Winning back the Internet by building our own

#108

Post by selfhoster11 »

xpe wrote: post #72
jrnichols wrote: post #56

The internet as we know it would be just fine if we de-commercialized it. Most websites as we know it don't need to be riddled with ads, google fonts, social media trackers, analytics. "But how do we make money from it?" - if that's the first thought, then maybe it doesn't need to be there. I'd rather have the internet for sharing reliable information, not advertising. It was doing just fine before corporate marketin…

What are some alternatives you would suggest? Please incorporate these aspects: 1. Running a network and computers costs money. 2. Commercial forces seek out channels where attention exists. 3. There is an incentive for content providers to place ads. 4. (add your own factors)

Server hosting for smaller services is no longer expensive when cheap cloud servers and Raspberry Pi computers are available.

Re: Winning back the Internet by building our own

#109

Post by l33tman »

dnautics wrote: post #78

Perhaps this is self-serving of me, since I want to build a product like this, but: I think honestly the problem is that these systems are not consumer-oriented products. I think there is a real desire by people to not have to live as rentiers in the digital marketplace, but there are not really products that cater to that. IMO There's a place for something that merges a NAS, with some sort of overlay over current IP…

Isn't this built into all modern Wifi routers? Asus has had this for 10 years or so, and they also had their share of security issues that comes with the territory :/

Re: Winning back the Internet by building our own

#110

Post by tomcam »

dnautics wrote: post #62
Hnrobert42 wrote: post #47

Discussing torrents: > people were more easily able to access the things they needed without being forced to ask or pay for permission to have them. Haha. We’re not talking about folks stealing bread to feed their family. We’re talking about people stealing entertainment. There’s a lot wrong with big media corporations: DMCA takedown notice misuse, copyright for life of the artist + 75 years, exploitative contracts,…

> watching movies and show you didn’t pay for is theft When I have a bike and you steal it from me, you are depriving me of the use of that bicycle. That's what makes it theft. There is no deprival, therefore no theft in "watching something you didn't pay for". If you argue "you are depriving the right of the artist to make money" that makes the assumption that the right of an artist to coerce money out of the counte…

How does an artist “coerce money” out of someone? Unless you mean robbery?
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